Did the rat pack have anything to do with the mafia? Today I seen a movie about them, and some mobsters were talking about whacking them.

Yes, Sinatra had connections although he denied it during all his life. Coppola built the character of the singer around Sinatra's real life and he even wanted him for the role but Sinatra turned him down -who knows why ?!

Maybe Sinatra didn't want the role of Johnny Fontaine cause that might have caused him to be typecast, untruly of course, as a famous singer with organized crime connections. Wise decision on his part to have turned down the role! :-)

I read a book called "The Last Mafioso" and there was a pic that took up 2 pages of Frank Sinatra with a group of wiseguys in his dressing room. One wiseguy in the group was none other than Carlo Gambino.

Here's the pic that Luca was talking about:

Grazi! SC I forgot Paul C was in the pic as well.

Ws he the 3rd guy standing from the right?

SC : a technical Q? here : how do you import pictures without giving the URL -if you did so ???

So much for Frank claiming he didn't know or associate with wiseguys....huh? :rolleyes:

Paul,
TO answer your question more specifically, yes they did. Here is how ; Peter Lawford was married into the Kennedy family and also a member of Sinatras group. Peter intorduced Sinatra to John F. Kennedy and they hit it off from the get go. When John F. Kennedy was running for President, he used Sinatras connections with Sam Giancana to have Giancana use his Union Influences to convince the union memebers to vote John F. Kennedy. For if Kennedy did not get the Union votes, then most likely he would have lost the election. Giancana did this as a favor to Sinatra on behalf of the Kennedys. However once Kennedy won the Presidency, he eventually appointed his brother Robert Attorney General and his father and brother Robert decided that they no longer wanted any affiliations with Sinatra because he had connections to Sam Giancana! SO basically they used him. To add insult to injury, Brother Robert went after the same mobsters who a few years earlier helped put his brother in office! That is why the mob was so pissed off, and almost took it out on Sinatra. WHat always bothered me about the Kennedys is that they, especially Father Joe and brother Robert, forgot where they came from. Always pointing fingers, going after people, etc. Joseph Kennedy was a bootlegger, that's how they made all of thier money, Illegally! THen years later they had the nerve to call this one and that one criminals! Well, as they say " The Sins of the Fathers." Guess that was true for the entire Kennedy family.

Paul,
TO answer your question more specifically, yes they did. Here is how ; Peter Lawford was married into the Kennedy family and also a member of Sinatras group. Peter intorduced Sinatra to John F. Kennedy and they hit it off from the get go. When John F. Kennedy was running for President, he used Sinatras connections with Sam Giancana to have Giancana use his Union Influences to convince the union memebers to vote John F. Kennedy. For if Kennedy did not get the Union votes, then most likely he would have lost the election. Giancana did this as a favor to Sinatra on behalf of the Kennedys. However once Kennedy won the Presidency, he eventually appointed his brother Robert Attorney General and his father and brother Robert decided that they no longer wanted any affiliations with Sinatra because he had connections to Sam Giancana! SO basically they used him. To add insult to injury, Brother Robert went after the same mobsters who a few years earlier helped put his brother in office! That is why the mob was so pissed off, and almost took it out on Sinatra. WHat always bothered me about the Kennedys is that they, especially Father Joe and brother Robert, forgot where they came from. Always pointing fingers, going after people, etc. Joseph Kennedy was a bootlegger, that's how they made all of thier money, Illegally! THen years later they had the nerve to call this one and that one criminals! Well, as they say " The Sins of the Fathers." Guess that was true for the entire Kennedy family.[/b][/quote]I know it's "Un-American" to say it but the whole Kenedy family makes me sick.
The media in this country has all but canonized them and for what?
The old man, Joe Kennedy was a rum-runner and serial adulterer who gained quite a bit of his fortune by selling out before the big crash of 1929. JFK, well we ALL know that story, Ted, also an adulterer, who got away with manslaughter because of who he was and the saga continues........

Kudos Scarlett! I agree with you 100% I for one don't understand the amazement with the Kennedy family. They should have used the Kennedy's family history in the GF trilogy. Their as corrupt as any mafia family in the trilogy.

Frank was cool, wasn't he? I loved him in "From here to Eternity".

Does anyone (Turnbull?) know if the Hollywood legend about Frank Sinatra and Joe Dimaggio having busted down a Hotel room door one time is true? Supposedly
Dimaggio thought he was going to find Marilyn in that Hotel room with another man but it was just some old lady's room.

I hadn't heard that hotel room door story, Scarlett, but it's well known that DiMaggio got physical in springing Marilyn from a mental hospital after their divorce.
Morris Engelberg, Dimaggio's lawyer, wrote an articel for Vanity Fair in which he said Sinatra was prominent on DiMaggio's s**t-list. Engelberg said that DiMaggio blamed Monroe's drug and alcohol addiction, and her death from an apparent overdose, on Sinatra and the Kennedy brothers. DiMaggio thought Sinatra introduced Monroe to the Kennedys in exchange for political favors.

I understood that Sinatra was very against Godfather Part I as he felt it was a slur on the
Italian American Community.
He believed that the character of Johnny Fontane was based on him and was upset by this implication.
But after the great success of Part I, I believe he had a re-think and would have liked to be in Part II.

What can you say? - you gotta admire the man's inconsistency!!!!!

Hi Wiseguy,

I too remember hearing that Sinatra was against that film, or at least protested the Johnny Fontaine character. At the time it was released I remember everyone saying that Fontaine was suppose to be based on Sinatra.

That photo of Frank and the boys was taken at The Westchester Premier Theater. The place was notoriously mobbed up. It was owned, run and staffed by mob goons right down to the parking valets. It was a classic example of a mob "bust out" operation, sucked dry of all assets and run into bankruptcy. It was a big story, I remember the news coverage years ago. A bust out is what happened to the Bamboo Lounge in Goodfellas after Paulie became a partner but I don't think they torched the Westchester for insurance.
As for DiMaggio, I've read that Joltin Joe was also questioned by the FBI for being a little too chummy with some mafia guys.

Fanucci, where you been, dude? We've been missing your expertise around here. Between you and our other resident experts, "we don't need no stinkin' Mafia books!" Anyways, good to see you back...cool new avatar, by the way!

On the front page of The NY Post or NY Daily news sometime back was a giant front page headline (a bit after his death) that said "KING RAT" with a picture of Sinatra under it...
The journalist allegedly had proof from the FBI (under the Freedom of Information Act), that Frank had gone to the FBI later in his life to give up all the info he had on organized crime. They flatly rejected his offer. Anyone from NY/NJ areas see that article?

Youse guys amaze me!!! Is there anything any of you DON'T know?

Others on these boards have pointed out another parallel between Sinatra and Johnny Fontaine. Seems the bandleader story really happened. The bandleader in Sinatra's case was Tommy Dorsey, and the Luca Brazi character was Willie Moretti, a much-feared NJ Mafioso who was an ally of many Dons.

Following on from everyone's comments on Sinatra; I remember reading somewhere that when casting was being done for Part III that Frank was very interested in the role of Don Altobello.

Setting aside the issue of Sinatra's earlier comments about Part 1, does anyone know how serious Frank was taken in his interest in
Part III?

Of course, the part went to Eli Wallach, but how do you think Frank would have done?

I think anyone would have been more convincing than Eli Wallach.

OK I knew the moffia had something to do with the Kennedy family...uh, issues. My family thinks I'm crazy...but they think The Godfather is a bad movie.

I really think they had Marilyn Monroe whacked too!
But why,...does anyone Know?

I remember reading that Brando was seeing her and he said she was doing well and he doesn't think she would have killed herself.

I might be crazy but I kinda feel like all "unexplainable" stuff is moffia related.
Except for like alien trailer park stories perhaps!
...but you never know!

Turnball,

What a cynical response about Eli Wallach!!

But, you have a point - he moved kind of funny, camped it up and exaggerated all his gestures.

There is that scene of him leaving the Commission Meeting just before the helicopter attack. He flusters out after Joey Zasa.

I thought he looked like an arthritic Charlie Chaplin who'd taken some super strength speed!

On the other hand he was able to convincingly steer the course between senile old family friend and jealous plotter.

But back to Frank, how'd you all think he'd do
as Altobello?

Sinatra was an accomplished actor who played tough guy roles exceptionally well, on both sides of the law (as Tony Rome, a detective, and in "Suddenly," a taut, first-rate little presidential assassination thriller also starring Sterling Hayden). He would have made a fine Don Altobello in his prime. But I think he was into his final decline when GFIII was being filmed.

Turnbull, I have to say I can't see Frank in that role, just like I couldn't See George Hamilton in Toms role either. That is what made the Godfather movies so good no type casting, no faces that you knew from other movies and had a pre-lock on that person....

Trust me, Scarlett - it's NOT un-American. They make me sick, too. They're a bunch of hypocrites, and they ARE canonized for no good reason. They used Sinatra to help them win in 1960, then turned their back on him because of his friendship w/ Sammy. What drives me nuts is when they're referred to as 'America's Royalty', or when JFK Jr. died, he was mourned as 'America's Prince'!!! Little mention that his death was due to his recklessnes and inexperience as a pilot, and that he took his wife & sister-in-law with him. It all started when JFK was assasinated; that made this previously not-very-popular President (who might very well have lost re-election in '64) a martyr. That started the wheels turning that put the whole family a step above the rest of us.

Apple

They get away with it beccause people let them, they put them on a stand and treat them like they are special....I was so sick about hearing aboyt How wonderful John Jr. was.... get real he had a golden spoon in his mouth since he was born...and JFK was just like anyone else...but the myth grew and grew and grew...Uncle Teddy is a wind bag.

I think Caroline seems to be the only normal one, and she stays out of the public view!

How many rat packers were they and who were they? I know about Frank Sinatra and I've seen that photo quite a few times. Was Sinatra Sicillian? Thanks

FH