Uh, maybe this is a dumb question. But, why is it that in GFIII, when Zaza offers Michael a cigarette, he refuses. I mean, is this supposed to be part of his character, a changed man? Or is it health reasons? It seems unlikely, b/c in 1979 everybody was still smoking. And, could it be because Pacino himself had quit before the start of shooting?

Is the answer in the commentaries perhaps?

As far as I know Pacino was a smoker in 1990 and is still a smoker. His (Michael Corleone's) refusal is most likely symbolic of the changes he has tried to make to his character..

I started a topic on this during the old-GF board days. Most of the responses I got were that Michael's character was more health-conscious, already having suffered diabetes and sinus problems, therefore he'd be more vigilant towards small health hazards like cigarettes. I read in a credible article that Pacino switched to smoking herbal cigarettes after his doctor urged him to stop tobacco to save his voice. The prescription makes sense in some ways, considering how much graver his voice has become, not just since GF but also Scarface, Carlito's way etc. Since he has some of the most memorable film quotes around, let's hope he keeps his larynx in shape for at least another 10 years.

[ November 03, 2001: Message edited by: Joey Montana ]

I think he stopped smoking cigarettes because he noticed that Barzini was the only Don at the big powwow in Part I who was smoking a cigarette (everyone else smoking cigars), and must have concluded it was the sure sign of a traitor. Plus he may have seen the still photo of Luca with a cigarette holder that appears on the bonus disk and could have concluded that it was an awfully effete touch for a guy who goes around chopping off horses' heads and Capone-men legs.

Just thought i'd include that, Pacino in Carlito's Way (1992) was still smoking in the film. I guess, even though the film is set in 1979 it still has to relate to 1990's audiences,(hence the lack of realistic shaggy hair and bell bottom-type suits).

I think in one of the scenes, Pacino is wearing a black suit with a dark, red, maroonish, shiny shirt with matching tie (kinda like what Regis wears on WWTBAMillionaire). There's no way that's 1979! People were more health conscious by 1990, so i guess the health thing workx.

How about Don Vito Corleone? He smoked di Nobeli in the novel, but I've never seen him smoke in the movie...

I think Vito was smoking in the Signor Roberto scene.

The cigarette is a symbolic tool that is used to show where Micheal's head is at in the films.
In pt.1, he goes to light a cig for Enzio at the hospital and notices how calm his hand under the stress of the moment. In 2, he lights a cigarette in his argument with Kay to check himself to stay in control. In 3, he's trying to step away from that kind of life and in that, disowning that crutch is apart of that. It's symbolic of him really trying to clean up the family.

Go get 'em, s.d.!!!

I never noticed the symbolism of those 'cigarette' moments...but each makes incredible sense. Now I've got to know - did you read or hear that somewhere, or are you brilliant enough to have seen it yourself????

Salud,
Apple

I like SD's points. However, couldn't it be that he just didn't like ZaZa and just wanted to make their meeting "less casual" than it would've been if he accepted that cigarrette?

PS: I haven't seen part III in ages and I can't remember if he does or does not smoke in the entire movie....If he had quite, than an associate/representative/ally like Zaza would've known that his Boss does/does not smoke....

AppleOnYa,
That made me smile, thanks. It's funny that someone started this discussion about Micheal's smoking. I first noticed in the first Godfather when I was about 18 the scene at the hospital and why the camera lingered on Micheal so long after he lit the cigarette. I finally figured out it was because he noticed his hand wasn't shaking and he could be calm under stress.
As the years went on and I watched the movies over and over, I noticed the cigarette tool was used in other scenes as well. Notice in I & II, anytime Micheal is put up against the wall and cornered, he lights up. Yes, in the context of the scene, he's like anyone else who gets stressed and goes to light up. But I don't see Micheal was a common chain smoker who just lit up at any given time. FFC used the cigarette as his tool to measure his self control. A device to keep his composure. The irony is in scenes that immediatly follow him lighting up, he ends up totally losing it anyway.
Examples:
1)At the end of the I, when he talks to Kay and she keeps berating him about Carlo. He lights up,then explodes.
2)In II,In the hotel with Kay, he tries to hold it together and run his pimp game on her as he lights up, but when she drops the abortion line, he explodes completly.
3)In II, at the New Years Eve Party in Cuba, when the revelation is made about Fredo's betrayal.
He lights up and puts his head down and then after trying to be cool, he says f*** it and plants the kiss of death on Fredo, kinda losing it. Definitely breaking his cool.
4) Also in I, right after he lights up with Enzio,
the cops pull up and Micheal goes off on McCloskey, which is really his turning point as he gets bitch slapped for opening his mouth.

In III, within the context of the scene, he is rejecting the cig from ZsaZsa because he really doesn't like him, but also because he is trying to reject the things and people of the mob world. The cigarette was apart of that and Micheal is trying to clean himself up as well as his family.
I believe it was definitely a symbolic device by FFC. Man, you think I watch the Godfather too much? (:

Aparently, Michael doesn't smoke in GF3... I've read the original shooting script, and theres a scene where Grace comes to see Michael...

She kisses him and says "...Good. You don't smoke..."

Hmmm...

noledge

Fabulous revelation, s.d....and all your examples are right on the money!!! If I recall correctly, another is in GF when Michael goes to Vegas to buy out Moe Green. After confronting Moe and getting his(probably expected) outraged reaction, Mike immediately lights up & is still smoking after Moe leaves & Fredo begins his tirade. Smoking seems to be a control mechanism for Michael.

I'm really impressed that someone was perceptive enough to note this use of symbolism by FFC! I'll definitely watch out for Michael's cigarette moments.

And by the way....there's no such thing as watching The Godfather too much...

Apple

[ December 04, 2001: Message edited by: AppleOnYa ]

[ December 05, 2001: Message edited by: AppleOnYa ]

Not strictly true...

Thats like saying "...You can't have too much of a good thing..." Which is also not true, as I discovered when i ate an entire chocolate gatteaux (how do you spell it?) while in the bath...

Now heres me thinking that gatteuax was a good thing, but I soon abandoned this theory when I started having dreams involded giant rolling marbles and Kenneth Williams...

I then proceeded to the bathroom to hurl, but began to hullucinate on the way: "...The walls! they move I tell you!..."

Anyroad, got me a week off school...



noledge

Yeah, but the question remains: will you ever go near the chocolate gatteaux again? Sure you will, the memories of um, the chocolate, the bath (?yeah those two go together?), the rolling marbles, the hallucinations amid the porcelain God, and what? a week off school??!! will fade soon enough.

My point is - You CAN'T ever get enough of a good thing. You may however have to take a break from it for a while.....

Well how about more than one of the same thing.Like buying the same good movie more than once.I dont want to buy 5 copies of the same good movie.

Hi, i am actually the person who started the topic, but i lost my password. :-).

Anyway, on to more relevant matters,

SD is right on the mark. However, then, not to poke holes, but just maybe your brilliant brain can think of an explanation for this.
In GFII, Michael is trudging thru the snow, and there is a closeup with him and a cig. WHy?>

I mean, one could say it's the trial thats "stressing" him out, but i dunno. All the other examples were more immediate, eg. Kay getting 2 excited, his brother doing the same, etc.

In that scene he comes inside the house and he puts his cig. on the ashtray.

"...everything that I like will make me sick, or poor, or fat...." (Van Halen)