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Re: Fredo's "Good Heart" [Re: Sicilian Babe] #393592
05/16/07 10:54 AM
05/16/07 10:54 AM
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 18,238
The Ravenite Social Club
Don Cardi Offline
Caporegime
Don Cardi  Offline
Caporegime

Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 18,238
The Ravenite Social Club
Sure they did. But not on a level that you're implying here. Fredo was not around him on a day to day basis. Perhaps Fredo came home for the holidays, a special occassion, something of that nature. But not long enough to realize the kind of person that his brother really was.



Don Cardi cool

Five - ten years from now, they're gonna wish there was American Cosa Nostra. Five - ten years from now, they're gonna miss John Gotti.




Re: Fredo's "Good Heart" [Re: Don Cardi] #393594
05/16/07 10:58 AM
05/16/07 10:58 AM
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 17,300
New York
Sicilian Babe Offline
Sicilian Babe  Offline

Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 17,300
New York
DC, You and I are NEVER going to agree on Fredo!! You see him so differently than I do.


President Emeritus of the Neal Pulcawer Fan Club
Re: Fredo's "Good Heart" [Re: Sicilian Babe] #393596
05/16/07 11:00 AM
05/16/07 11:00 AM
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 18,238
The Ravenite Social Club
Don Cardi Offline
Caporegime
Don Cardi  Offline
Caporegime

Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 18,238
The Ravenite Social Club
Yeah, I see him with my heart. You see him with your head. ;\)



Can't you forgive FREDO -- he's so sweet and helpless without you.



Don Cardi cool

Five - ten years from now, they're gonna wish there was American Cosa Nostra. Five - ten years from now, they're gonna miss John Gotti.




Re: Fredo's "Good Heart" [Re: Don Cardi] #393605
05/16/07 11:23 AM
05/16/07 11:23 AM
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 17,300
New York
Sicilian Babe Offline
Sicilian Babe  Offline

Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 17,300
New York
Sorry, can't do it, Cardi.


President Emeritus of the Neal Pulcawer Fan Club
Re: Fredo's "Good Heart" [Re: Sicilian Babe] #393606
05/16/07 11:24 AM
05/16/07 11:24 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 23,296
Throggs Neck
pizzaboy Offline
The Fuckin Doctor
pizzaboy  Offline
The Fuckin Doctor

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 23,296
Throggs Neck
You'll never change each other's minds. Great topic to agree to disagree on.


"I got news for you. If it wasn't for the toilet, there would be no books." --- George Costanza.
Re: Fredo's "Good Heart" [Re: Sicilian Babe] #393610
05/16/07 11:30 AM
05/16/07 11:30 AM
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 18,238
The Ravenite Social Club
Don Cardi Offline
Caporegime
Don Cardi  Offline
Caporegime

Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 18,238
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 Originally Posted By: Sicilian Babe
Sorry, can't do it, Cardi.


A refusal is not the act of a friend.



Don Cardi cool

Five - ten years from now, they're gonna wish there was American Cosa Nostra. Five - ten years from now, they're gonna miss John Gotti.




Re: Fredo's "Good Heart" [Re: pizzaboy] #393646
05/16/07 12:20 PM
05/16/07 12:20 PM
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 15,032
Texas
O
olivant Offline
olivant  Offline
O

Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 15,032
Texas
"This is the business we've chosen."

I love it!


"Generosity. That was my first mistake."
"Experience must be our only guide; reason may mislead us."
"Instagram is Twitter for people who can't read."
Re: Fredo's "Good Heart" [Re: pizzaboy] #393732
05/16/07 11:24 PM
05/16/07 11:24 PM
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 8
LISBON,PORTUGAL
D
DONPARDO Offline
Associate
DONPARDO  Offline
D
Associate
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 8
LISBON,PORTUGAL
Turbull,with all due respect,I thought Fredo's line:"The Japs didn't know it was Pops' Birthday"(and then Sonny's reaction), was one of the funniest in either movie.

Re: Fredo's "Good Heart" [Re: DONPARDO] #393733
05/16/07 11:35 PM
05/16/07 11:35 PM
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 15,032
Texas
O
olivant Offline
olivant  Offline
O

Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 15,032
Texas
 Originally Posted By: DONPARDO
Turbull,with all due respect,I thought Fredo's line:"The Japs didn't know it was Pops' Birthday"(and then Sonny's reaction), was one of the funniest in either movie.


Ditto.


"Generosity. That was my first mistake."
"Experience must be our only guide; reason may mislead us."
"Instagram is Twitter for people who can't read."
Re: Fredo's "Good Heart" [Re: olivant] #393822
05/17/07 11:14 AM
05/17/07 11:14 AM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 11,468
With Geary in Fredo's Brothel
dontomasso Offline OP
Consigliere to the Stars
dontomasso  Offline OP
Consigliere to the Stars

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 11,468
With Geary in Fredo's Brothel
Despite his misgivings about Fredo, Michael allowed Fredo to attend the meeting with Moe Green in which Michael tells Moe to come up with a price for his hotel. In a foreshadowing of his later betrayal, Fredo takes sides against the family by asking Tom to get involved and make a different deal. Michael stenly warns him to never take sides against the family again....ever.

At that moment if not sooner Fredo had to know he had been "passed over" and that Michael was now in charge of the family business, and by his boneheaded move he should have raised Michael's and Tom's antennae also, and I can only guess what they were not keepiong a closer eye on him when he went galavanting off to Cuba with Johnny Ola and Hymand Roth, and having secret meetings with Ola in Beverly Hills.

Certainly none of these actions show a man who has a "good heart."


"Io sono stanco, sono imbigliato, and I wan't everyone here to know, there ain't gonna be no trouble from me..Don Corleone..Cicc' a port!"

"I stood in the courtroom like a fool."

"I am Constanza: Lord of the idiots."

Re: Fredo's "Good Heart" [Re: dontomasso] #393824
05/17/07 11:22 AM
05/17/07 11:22 AM
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 295
ScarFather Offline
Capo
ScarFather  Offline
Capo
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 295
 Originally Posted By: dontomasso
Despite his misgivings about Fredo, Michael allowed Fredo to attend the meeting with Moe Green in which Michael tells Moe to come up with a price for his hotel. In a foreshadowing of his later betrayal, Fredo takes sides against the family by asking Tom to get involved and make a different deal. Michael stenly warns him to never take sides against the family again....ever.

At that moment if not sooner Fredo had to know he had been "passed over" and that Michael was now in charge of the family business, and by his boneheaded move he should have raised Michael's and Tom's antennae also, and I can only guess what they were not keepiong a closer eye on him when he went galavanting off to Cuba with Johnny Ola and Hymand Roth, and having secret meetings with Ola in Beverly Hills.

Certainly none of these actions show a man who has a "good heart."



Like Vito, Michael allowed Fredo to sit in on meeting.
Fredo surely knew at this point that Michael was head of family... he just wasnt respecting/recognizing him as HEAD.
When he goes to Tom he is NOT aware that Tom is no longer consig. Tom has no pull.
As far as antenae.. in hindsight he should have been watched... but Tom and Michael didnt view Fredo as dangerous.


I mentioned in another thread that Tom could have left Michael in between GF2 and 3 for a few reasons. Another reason could be that Tom left Michael because he killed Fredo. Tom could not forgive Michael and leave OR Tom could fear for his life.

Just alternate storylines that I have thought about...


"What I want.... whats most important to me... is that I have a guarantee" - Train approaches.... Bang! Bang! Bang!
Re: Fredo's "Good Heart" [Re: ScarFather] #393827
05/17/07 11:35 AM
05/17/07 11:35 AM
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 19,716
AZ
Turnbull Offline
Turnbull  Offline

Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 19,716
AZ
I think Tom could not forgive Paramount for not offering him enough money to appear in III. ;\)


Ntra la porta tua lu sangu � sparsu,
E nun me mporta si ce muoru accisu...
E s'iddu muoru e vaju mparadisu
Si nun ce truovo a ttia, mancu ce trasu.
Re: Fredo's "Good Heart" [Re: Turnbull] #393840
05/17/07 12:01 PM
05/17/07 12:01 PM
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 295
ScarFather Offline
Capo
ScarFather  Offline
Capo
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 295
 Originally Posted By: Turnbull
I think Tom could not forgive Paramount for not offering him enough money to appear in III. ;\)


Yeah LOL... I posted here a while back that I saw an interview with Duvall and he said something to the effect "Al is the bigger star... but atleast offer me half of what you are giving him"... I guess they really lowballed him to get more money for the vineyard.

I am suprised that no one really see's more possible conflict that Tom may have had towards Michael between 2 and 3. Yet another storyline...


"What I want.... whats most important to me... is that I have a guarantee" - Train approaches.... Bang! Bang! Bang!
Re: Fredo's "Good Heart" [Re: ScarFather] #393872
05/17/07 02:33 PM
05/17/07 02:33 PM
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 15,032
Texas
O
olivant Offline
olivant  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 15,032
Texas
I don't know Duvall's finances, but I guess that he was pretty well heeled by then. Why wouldn't he think more about being part of an American epic and put his money concerns aside?


"Generosity. That was my first mistake."
"Experience must be our only guide; reason may mislead us."
"Instagram is Twitter for people who can't read."
Re: Fredo's "Good Heart" [Re: olivant] #393884
05/17/07 02:52 PM
05/17/07 02:52 PM
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 295
ScarFather Offline
Capo
ScarFather  Offline
Capo
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 295
 Originally Posted By: olivant
I don't know Duvall's finances, but I guess that he was pretty well heeled by then. Why wouldn't he think more about being part of an American epic and put his money concerns aside?


I hear ya... but GF3 was ALL ABOUT MONEY, no? So why would he take that angle?


"What I want.... whats most important to me... is that I have a guarantee" - Train approaches.... Bang! Bang! Bang!
Re: Fredo's "Good Heart" [Re: ScarFather] #393897
05/17/07 03:20 PM
05/17/07 03:20 PM
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 19,716
AZ
Turnbull Offline
Turnbull  Offline

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Posts: 19,716
AZ
More's the pity about Duvall not being in GFIII because some here have seen alternate scripts for III in which Hagen was skimming from the casinos and/or having Sonny's widow Sandra as his mistress...


Ntra la porta tua lu sangu � sparsu,
E nun me mporta si ce muoru accisu...
E s'iddu muoru e vaju mparadisu
Si nun ce truovo a ttia, mancu ce trasu.
Re: Fredo's "Good Heart" [Re: Turnbull] #393985
05/17/07 10:47 PM
05/17/07 10:47 PM
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 8
LISBON,PORTUGAL
D
DONPARDO Offline
Associate
DONPARDO  Offline
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Associate
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LISBON,PORTUGAL
I would love to read what the alternate script was if Tom Hagen was still in the movie, has anyone posted anything other than the tid-bits that you gave Mr.Turnbull?

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