arguing over getting stuck with a $10 check would be petty. as you said the check was $1,200. yes it was CM's role to get it but paulie made sure it was inflated just to screw with him. i'd have been pissed too.

Honestly, I think your points are all very valid and interesting, but no more so than anyone who might reply with the following:

"But since we don't see Christopher ratting, and all we've got to go on is incidental symbolism from which to extrapolate meanings to suit our purpose, then he isn't a rat. It's not significant enough to be a storyline in itself though, otherwise Chase would have made it a storyline, and it would have been major. Chase isn't that subtle."

In short, I'd be content to say it's a very valid possibility that Christopher was ratting to the Feds. But with the evidence at hand, I remain agnostic, with a preference to saying that No, he wasn't.

Cops would have been curious about who murdered JT, but that's a speculation that could easily be met by positing another what-if: what if Chris rang Benny up, or Little Paulie, and had one of them get rid of the evidence? That's just as rational an assumption as yours, I think. Even if Chris is heavily intoxicated at the time.

The rest of your questions needn't be asked in light of these perpetual, mutually-defeating what-if scenarios. But Yes, if the cops did find the body, and did question Chris, then Chase and his writers are guilty of short-cutting, of leaving us short of reality. But I don't think that the cops seeing JT's body would then be able to leap to the conclusion that Chris did it. It would be long and drawn out, and the Feds would have nothing concrete to pin on him.

First off i appreciate your thoughtful response, however i disagree.

You say: "But since we don't see Christopher ratting, and all we've got to go on is incidental symbolism from which to extrapolate meanings to suit our purpose, then he isn't a rat. It's not significant enough to be a storyline in itself though, otherwise Chase would have made it a story line, and it would have been major. Chase isn't that subtle."

Wrong, Chase IS that subtle, especially in the final season. EVERYTHING means something. it is a story line in that it is NOT a story line. Chase loves these background stories -things that are going on that he doesn't show us. he want's us to follow clues to discover what is really happening. he constantly throws red herings to challenge us.

As for someone else coming to clean up the mess, i suppose that is possible. but why not show that phone call or the meeting? didn't that JT murder story line seem to be left hanging to you? in the context of all the other murders on the show, this is pretty serious. way more serious that the waiter in AC or any other random civilian who gets caught in the cross fire.
i know chase leaves things hanging out there (i.e. Furio, the russian in the woods) but this is a little more important. and very close to home.

it is a a very deliberate decision by Chase to not follow this story line in an obvious way. WHY do you think Chase does this? instead he toys with us, providing motive and method. Then he leaves subtle clues. he flips the hummer. he even throws in a cat to stare at the picture of CM.

still no one has commented on why CM does not want an ambulance after accident.

The Cat was staring at the Picture of Chris because he liked and missed Chris. Ade's dog was the cats worst enemy from down the street and after Chris accidentally whacked the Dog, the cat had profound respect for him.

This is at once interesting and negligible.


The exact same thing could be said for not showing Christopher meeting with the Feds.


In retrospect, yeah, I suppose it was. I've never really thought about until reading this thread. I'd actually put it down to poetic license, though, than anything else. It's a continuity fault on the part of Chase and co., not some genius subtlety.

The Sopranos is rich in subtext, but its symbolism is more obvious and immediate (ie. Bobby's model train entering a tunnel just after Vito and Johnny Cakes get heated up, which was hilarious).

I'm not one to treat the narrative as a puzzle.

Oh, and Christopher wants a cab because a medic would realise he's high.

"I'll never pass a blood test, T."

He's also probably concussed, and completely in denial about his need to go to hospital.

Could you please post a link to this video, Lompac? I'd love to see the footage!

Also, I don't think it would be reasonable to have to find a solution to the question here. No one can say with 100 % certainty whether Chris was a rat or not. That is EXACTLY what Chase wants - if we knew Chris was a rat, then some might view Tony's killing of Chris as justified. If he wasn't a rat, Tony's killing becomes more horrifying. Yet, if we are left with a degree of uncertainty, we are left in Tony's point of view, as we are for most of the show. In season 6B, more than any other season (one could argue), everything is focused on developing our opinions of Tony. What Chase wants is to create an air of disgust and dislike in Tony Soprano. After all, he is a murderer and criminal.

you are lazy. you miss the beauty of the show if you refuse to examine it closely.

this seems to be a cop out response.

Do people with concussions do that? do they refuse treatment for trivial reasons? are we to rule out anything anyone says after an accident as invalid then? maybe that is why tony killed CM, because tony was concussed also.

to CM a valid or even real drivers license would be a trivial concern. THese guys are professionals at faking and falsification. Remember the stock trading company CM ran? or all of the stolen/phoney calling cards, airline tickets, etc. they sold? I'm certain he cares very little about whether the state of NJ considers him a valid driver or not. I'm certain he'd rather not die than lose his license.

unless we want to just write off everything weird he does/says after the accident as the inconsequential and meaningless product of a blow to the head, this should raise questions as to CM's real motivation for refusing treatment.

yet he tells tony that this is his reason for not wanting an ambulance.

thank you. but there is more... just like in life. i can't prove the cm flipped it is a work of art and not real life and because chase does not allow us to see it happen. i think all of the evidence points to the fact that he did flip. i think this is chase at his best. he developed these characters over time with such complexity that if you are watching closely you can fill in some blanks and deduce a whole separate story line which explains what on the surface be inexplicable behavior, such as: killing JT, the hat, the refusal of treatment, the overly dramatic flipping of the hummer, the mysterious cat staring at his picture...

again this subtlety is the fun of the sopranos. to blow shit off as coincidence or as the result of a concussion, or even to try to understand their behavior through the lens of your own (presumably normal) value system or world view is to miss the greatness of the show. then to me you are just another clown who watched the show just to see paulie occasionally beat people up. to reduce tony to black and white - a monster or not a monster.

actually i looked at that episode. they didn't stuff the hat in massarone's mouth. they put a golf club cover in there. i believe it was a 5 iron? it ad a 5 on it anyway. but the hat is nowhere to be seen in the trunk. there is no indication that they knew about the hat.

Chris wasnt a rat. I always thought carmella was the one who was going to be the one who brought down the jersey mafia so she could save her own family.

ds

I totally agree with you.

I've always liked Christopher. I could always relate to him (in so many ways).

I think that this raises a brilliant point. He could well be a rat. We have already been through that story line with Big Pussy, so David would very well decide not to repeat it through Christophers character. (Doesn't mean it isn't so) Did Ralphie kill the horse. Was that Barry Haydu really Chrissys fathers killer. Does Tony realise Chris gave Meadow her first stash of drugs when she confronts her father about it in the episode College. (He certainly sits at the dinner table thinking it through) And what happened to the guy in Pine Barrens. This show was meant for open interpretation. And means we could all be right in our own ways.

It is Carmine who suggests the extra kill in Cleaver for cinematic effect and not in fact Christopher. But Carmela convinces Tony that it is a personal dig at him. The relationship again takes a bad nosedive. Just maybe Chris thinks if i had not put all my trust and faith into this mob family i would still have Adriana and we wouldn't have gone through all of this. Maybe he does flip...well done.

However I believe the heroine (Which has a close resemblance to the pain killing drug that hospitals use - morphine) may have allowed Christopher to feel no pain from his injuries, which in turn, allows him to ask for a taxi in a kind of black humour way. It's sad cause i think hes so high he cant feel the pain.

In a way that is the obvious thing really. Im happy with that answer. In saving private ryan and the second world war they'd issue heroine for total pain relief. Trust me, Christopher isn't feeling it at that point.
And another thing, anyone hating Tony a little, Chris does look in really bad shape. When he opens the door, the metal interior causes Chris to cough up alot of blood. He may well have passed away anyway.

I'm new here,but heres my take......Christopher was a rat.......and this is a big strech......
remember when CM and Tony are driving and Christopher turns up the volume on the radio.
Perhaps he turned up the volume in order to help conceal the fact that his wire wasn't wasn't working right and Tony could hear some "feedback" or etc...

and in closing..when the accident happened......the SUV "rolled over"......just like a rat does...

A big stretch is RIGHT...but interesting point. However, even I don't think Chase is THAT subtle.

Chris was a lot of things a drug addict, a loose canon but no rat. Think about it he had plenty of oppurtunities to rat but remained loyal to the family. Hell he even gave up his fiance to be killed in order to remain loyal and not break the omerta so i doubt Chris would even turn despite what he said when he was drunk

He Didnt get Whacked?
Let his woman get clipped by Sil?
Heroin Junkie-Yes..Rat.?

I doubt Chris was rat. Believe me Chris was a lot fo things a junkie,bad temperment, disorganized. But the one thing you can say is that he never cooperated with the FBI. If you need proof look at the Adriana situation he could have become and rat to be with his girl but he said fuck that and let her die. Also Chris never regretted that decision he just wanted some gratitude which Tony never gave. Everyone says Silvio was the most loyal and Iagree but Chris was definetly up there. Paulie was a blabbermouth who came close to being clipped I still don't know why Tony spared him because he knew that he was talking to New York.

Three words on this topic:

Not A Chance.

David Chase would have used every opportunity to suck us into that storyline.

Naw Chris was not a rat, I think he was considering it after the party before he went to JT's apartment, he was talking about how none of the guys had his back and were laughing at him, but the momeent JT showed that he didnt have his back Chris realized that one he had said to much to JT, which was why he killed him and 2 he found out that the other side would not have his back either so his best bet was to stick with Tony. I think Chase showed us how Chris was thinking when at the end as he was walking to into his house, he stood the tree back up, stood it up or was that stand it up as in "I am a stand up guy"

Yeah, I agree with Jvanley. A development that huge would've been made way more apparent to the audience. It's an interesting theory though.

You make a convincing argument. I am not convinced yet. I am going to have to consider this. But I must admit,
There is motive
Evidence
And a well laid out conspiracy.

The best thing Tony Soprano ever did as a mob boss was to kill Christopher Moltisanti. He was close to cooperating when Adriana told him about her situation. Then that scene with JT. It's obvious he had given this some serious thought and yeah that ballcap always looked a little off to me. Tony knew there was something going on with him. It wasn't just the drugs.

i dont think christopher was a rat. he was just a young gangster who thought he was more important than he really was and felt entitled to more than he had earned. I do understand y people say tony wanted chris gone and i am okay with that i just hate the way they did it.

you guys make my head spin with all these good theories

There is no proof to this. Chris wouldnt have ratted...