[/b][/quote]Yeah that was damn good.


Like you stated earlier, there was no clear cut winner in this debate. They both kept repeating the same thing over & over again.

One thing I have against Kerry is. He was saying how he'll help build up the firefighters, help build up the police force. One thing though just where in the hell is the money going to come from, will it just magically grow on a tree? :rolleyes:


Plus Kerry also said he'll change this, & change that, he'll get our allies involved. Yeah fine just one question kerry, just how in the hell are you going to accomplish all that? What are you going to do wave your magic wand? :rolleyes:

[/b][/quote]Yeah that was damn good.


Like you stated earlier, there was no clear cut winner in this debate. They both kept repeating the same thing over & over again.

One thing I have against Kerry is. He was saying how he'll help build up the firefighters, help build up the police force. One thing though just where in the hell is the money going to come from, will it just magically grow on a tree? :rolleyes:


Plus Kerry also said he'll change this, & change that, he'll get our allies involved. Yeah fine just one question kerry, just how in the hell are you going to accomplish all that? What are you going to do wave your magic wand? :rolleyes: [/b][/quote]Iceman you need to listen more closely lol. He is going to get the allies involved by CONSTANTLY DISRESPECTING THEM! He constantly left off countries like Poland and Australia and EVEN GREAT BRITAIN when he kept talking about "our allies".

Remember when Bush forgot to say Canada as an allie and they got PISSED, yeah that was an accident that happened ONCE. Kerry's weren't really "accidents" and it happend 3-4 times in a one hour period, they can't be too happy over that.

No he'll ask his fairy Godfather :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

I read the whole transcript on CNN. I see here some say Iran sanctions was what President Clinton initiated which is wrong, as President Bush said it was long there before he comes to D.C.

US unilateral sanctions against Iran began almost a quarter of a century ago after the take-over of the US embassy in Tehran (November 1979). President Carter responded immediately by issuing Proclamation 4702, imposing a ban on the importation into the US of Iranian oil. Ten days later, he issued Executive Order 12170, which blocked all property within US jurisdiction owned by the Central Bank and Government of Iran. In April 1980, President Carter issued Executive Order 12205, instituting an embargo on US exports to Iran (including restrictions on financial transactions) and Executive Order 12211, imposing a ban on all imports from Iran and prohibiting US citizens from traveling to Iran or conducting financial transactions there. Once the US hostages were released, the US revoked the previous executive orders, with the exception of the order blocking Iranian Government property within US jurisdiction, and committed the US not to intervene in Iran’s internal affairs.
Here is the link for further reading : http://www.mafhoum.com/press3/108E16.htm

What Senator Kerry said which was true was that these sanctions have not been effective because they are unilateral. I as an Iranian, don't want some nutcases (you know who) get to nuke, but I also want my country to be able to take advantage of nuclear power to produce electricity and I think what Sen. Kerry said was more practical in Iran. By working closely with Europeans and watching and controlling rather than denying the use of peaceful nuclear program in Iran.

About Iraq and plans and all, what really scares me is that you have to take a close look at what was going on in Iraq before Saddam. And if you do; you'll find out that Iraq was such an unstable country that had regime changes so many times you can't even imagine. No matter how many countries get involve in this situation even with a new face and new diplomacy of Mr. Kerry, unraveling what's done seems impossible. I remember my dad saying once there was a caricature in a magazine before Saddam comes to power showing a man who was going to take a potty break telling his wife to pay attention to see how many regimes would change until I'm done! And that's no joke and this is what's scary. Giving freedom to a nation that is not ready to handle it.
Other thing that President Bush said was that a peaceful Iraq would help Israel. I already said although I believe that was the main reason going there, (to make a democracy that recognizes Israel in the Middle East) it is not going to be practical because there is a long history of conflicts in that region. A democracy of Iraqi people, wouldn't approve such a thing, unless the US empowers a dictator willing to do so. Middle East is a very hard puzzle. It takes more than that to solve it. :rolleyes:

Yes, but you forget two things that they may now have.
1) a choice
2) a chance

and maybe you could add a third if you look hard enough.
3) Hope

I don't think after all the money that US put into this war, when they go out of this country and most likely a civil war begins and a government that does not recognize Israel come to power they like it. So there goes their choice.
Right now only 25% of people in Iraq would be able to vote in Jan. because of conflicts that's going on in so many places so there goes their chance.
I don't argue about Hope with you. That's what has kept any living person eager to live one more day, to see better days and brighter skies. We can keep our fingers crossed. But I'm not optimistic although I hope it works out.

Sure putting money into their country will not buy anything. But it will show them that someone is willing to put their money where their mouth is. We are giving them more then they have ever gotten from anyone else. We are Giving them something, not taking something away.

Maybe they will finally stand up to those who keep them down by taking their freedom, their way of making a living (so they can get ahead) and the things that the rest of us normally take for granted.

As always the other side will try and beat them down and ruin everything that gives their freedom back. Their hope is that we back out and leave so they may be in control once again. It is not easy to break the back of a system that has been around so long, but then again they have never been helped by a superpower such as the United States. My only fear is that Americans will be turned around by our own negative people who don't care what happens outside their own boarders and keep saying that things can never change.
Granted that past history does hold more value in an equation when looking to the future, but how often have people say that things could never happen, but it has. We can only hope that the people have not been so beaten up over the years that they don't stand up for themselves or support those that will.

We will wait and see. It is not like our opinion can change anything. Living for so long in the Middle East has taken away my optimism. :rolleyes:

http://www.tennessean.com/elections/2004/archives/04/09/58646616.shtml

Nobody follewed the "rules". I saw it on C-SPAN, which showed a split screen. - Isn't that a continuous reaction shot?

People, just because the guy is more articulate doesn't make him a better person to be president.

That doesn't make him a winner in a debate.

It is the facts and what each guy plans on doing in the next four years that matters.

There wasn't a person in this country who didn't want us to go after someone after 9/11. To get those people who did this to us. To get people who support the people who do these kind of things.
" to fight for truth and the American way"

Now it is it costs to much and it isn't the right place or time or the right guy... :rolleyes:

Exactly. We went into Afgahnistan. I don't know anyone who doesn't support that. Iraq, however, isn't "even near the center of the world on terror. Well, it wasn't until the President lied to us about WMDS and attacked us."

Rules are made to be broken. Lies are what get you elected, just watch the replay of the debates. If their noses grow each time they told one or broke one, neither guy could leave the stage.

Rules are made to be broken. Lies are what get you elected, just watch the replay of the debates. If their noses grow each time they told one or broke one, neither guy could leave the stage.