I've always been curios what their relationship was, were they friends or rivals? I don't think they spent a lot of time on the street together and they both ended up on the same side of the first Colombo war. but what side was Sonny on during the third one?

They were friends. Most mob historians have made too much out of their relationship being strained at one time or another. Some even claimed that Sonny sided with Orena during the war. Not true. Sonny always sided with Persico. He was just away at the time. I don't blame you for being confused, but this question should've been put to bed years ago. Shortly before he went away in 2008, Franzese was even caught on a wire saying how much he loved the Persicos.

carmine made sonny the official underboss around 2003 maybe earlier maybe later. there was a bunch of street bosses and or acting bosses while sonny was underboss some reasson carmione never made him street boss or acting. technically underboss is still a higher position then street boss or acting boss( see gerry catena reading tom eboli the riot act) sonny was on wire around 2005 praising michael persico with out really letting who he was talking to know just how powerfull michael was or is. he also said carmine was a stone cold killer or gangster. think they have a mutual respect. carmine in the 80tys could have took sonny out if he felt someway. it is interesting. sonny missed his shot after colombo was shot and tom dibella took power. i dont think gambino would have backed sonny. he was locked up from 1970 till 79 or close kinda why he never got up in the hierarchy plu50 yrs parole he cant associate with anyone

I read that The Snake feared that Sonny and Charlie Moose Panarella would try to take the family.

The rumors are out there and a lot to it .... Sonny was the man and a threat to Carmine .

But this I know the kids the boys were both from the mob silver spoon and and Michael was on the street before Allie but there was always talk about the family being rivals not in the sense of killing each other but definite jealousy and no doubt Sonny if released early could have caused problems for Carmine rise and it was known and Sonny and Carmine’s boys did not jel same as The Colombo boys same deal ....

Ive seen alot of Michael interviews. An for a fact he was carmine number 1 earner. I think the numbers are inflated but the gas tax scam from 1980 till 1985 made carmine a couple million. He made michael a capo i dont even think sonny was a capo in the 80tys cause he had parole restrictions. Ya ive never heard michael even mention allie boy. There almost same age. Think michaels like 4 yrs older. But never a peep. There both made around 76 77. He mentions his boss carmine here n there.

Carmine put a contract on michaels life in 1987 88 its in scarpas files. He also tried to put sonny on the shelf but he had to many guys on long island loyal to him. This is all greg scarpas telling the feds around 1988 qhen mike went in front of some grand jury. I think he was told if he keeps talking were going after your family in neq york so he stopd

just watched the last vlad tv michael franses interview its a good one. he tells alot. he says it was personal to carmine about michael walking away from the life. carmine orderd the hit and sonny didnt even try to stop it. great interview. i kinda respect mike but hes not selling that religion in these interviews probaly why

he didnt ride his fathers coat tails like jr gotti did but perhaps that cause his father was never the boss. and he had to go out and earn for the family to become a capo it wasnt just given to him. you kinda got to respect that about mike.

Agree, you gotta have the opportunity, which he had but without the balls someone could not do what he ( MF) did for himself and his Family ( both Families).

He mentions allie boy in an interveiw ive seen saying boss and underbosses sons thier fathers hoped one day theyd be boss and underboss its a long interveiw can't recall where

As I understand they did pal around a little in 70s or 80s

i seen him mention allie boy nut i think hes refering to carmines brother who was consig for most of the 70tys and the power on the street well carmines locked up. tom dibellas the boss carmine persico is official under boss and his brother allie boy is consig. this is all from like 73 to 1980. carmines locked up from like 1972 till 79. dibella had a acting underboss brancato or something during that time

I meant little allie boy and I remeber when I saw it it wasnt fitting with timeline we know as far as who was boss and underboss but that doesn't mean anything he could have been blowing smoke or maybe LE didnt know who the power really was I will find interview and post link for u

I cant recall him ever mentioning allie boy jr buy name he always says the bosses son or something like carmines kids. Makes me think theres bad blood there or michael nows allie jr still has power on the street to make him uncomfortable

Yea not by name ur rite I assumed it was little allie boy because they are same age and came up around same time its the vlad tv interveiw I think

mike never mentions greg scarpa ever either or his son. maybe he doesnt wan to piss off the feds let sleeping dogs lay. he never brought up like any still in the fold. vic orena or his sons who give interviews think allie jr put them on the shelf like he did the colombo brothers. i mean there still made guys and hang around other families but the colombo family was weary of doing bussiness with any of them which only makes me think allie boy jr even thou hes been locked up 20yrs still has friends on the street. and i thinking somehow hes the official boss. recently colombo capo joey amato is talking with a soldier in his crew about having to drive to north carolina and recieving carmines body at the prison to bring him back to brooklyn whose giving them these orders?? joey amato was a vic orena surporter and him and his crew were all at carmines secret wake and burial so im guessing someone in the persico family is the boss

Mike said as a kid he met carlo gambino with sonny so must of been around 1962/1963 soon after his ub promotion

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lNlR3lfnLR8 , new interview on 3rd april with mike tyson and eben britton

In the Newsweek documentary about Sonny it says Persico and Franzese were both in the same prison during the 70s and bonded.

Michael does mention Allie boy in an interview. He mentions him when speaking about carmine and sonnys overall goal for them and the future of the family. Michael says it had been talked about by carmine and sonny and elevating them both to capos was purposely because they wanted them to end up as michael says"boss, underboss or vice versa). I liked it because he was trying to keep his dad in such a high regard as if he had so much pull Then that carmine might even entertain the idea of Michael running the family over Allie boy.

Franzese also states that Persico issued a contract to have him murdered.

Tom DiBella became boss and Anthony Abbatemarco underboss in late 1972. Allie Persico was made consigliere in 1973. When DiBella went to jail from 74-75, Abbatemarco and Joseph Brancato were identified as acting for him at different times. Then Abbatemarco gets taken down and shelved in 77 for trying to take the family from DiBella and the Persicos. The underboss position is vacant until 1979, when Carmine gets out.
In 1980 Allie Persico goes on the lam and Jerry Langella is identified as acting consigliere. Carmine officially takes over as boss in late 1980 and Langella is identified as the official underboss in early 1981.

i think joe yacovelli had something to do with anthony abbatemarco trying to take over the family. he was shelved or forced into retirement to florida. he must have been well liked because he wasnt killed. is he still alive today? be like 90ty. after he killed crazy joe gallo or atleast orderd the hit he was kinda scarce. he was acting underboss for colombo or something. guy is a mystery and ive read him and persico was tight...

he was also only in his late 40tys when he was either shelved or retired. the guy who does the nymafia bios should do one on him if he doesnt already have one. must have been inducted at a early age like persico

Carmine persicos mother in laws surname was smaldone. Any relation to that little family from Denver?

Got the frank dimatteo book recently noticed it on one of the pics

i've read that benjamin castellazzo is the UB now since 2015 so when did john franzese stop being UB???
and for old times who is the boss???2019- gotta be someone.

Sonny’s brother Carmine was in carmine’s crew Apparently

According to the FBI dead list Tony Shots died in 2005 and Joe Yak died in 2006.