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Re: 73 Confidential FBI "Mafia" Informers Revealed!
[Re: NYMafia]
#1047217
01/03/23 08:54 AM
01/03/23 08:54 AM
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Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 12,482
NYMafia
OP
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OP
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 12,482
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FOH, Lou, I'm curious for you two to review the list. There are at least 6 rats listed who were directly from Pittsburgh, and a bunch more from PA itself.
The other states include NYS (NYC and the Upstate region), New Jersey, Pennsylvania, Maryland, Florida, Texas, Illinois, Michigan, and California.
Let me know if any names ring a bell for either of you. ok
Last edited by NYMafia; 01/03/23 10:18 AM.
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Re: 73 Confidential FBI "Mafia" Informers Revealed!
[Re: NYMafia]
#1047218
01/03/23 10:03 AM
01/03/23 10:03 AM
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Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 817
Friend_of_Henry
Underboss
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Underboss
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 817
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None of those names ring a bell for me.
"Never walk in a room that you don't know how to get out of"- Henry Zottola
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Re: 73 Confidential FBI "Mafia" Informers Revealed!
[Re: NYMafia]
#1047220
01/03/23 10:13 AM
01/03/23 10:13 AM
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Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 817
Friend_of_Henry
Underboss
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Underboss
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 817
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I reviewed your list again and other than I met Michael's "Squeeze", Frances, I knew none of the others.
"Never walk in a room that you don't know how to get out of"- Henry Zottola
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Re: 73 Confidential FBI "Mafia" Informers Revealed!
[Re: Friend_of_Henry]
#1047222
01/03/23 10:17 AM
01/03/23 10:17 AM
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Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 12,482
NYMafia
OP
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OP
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 12,482
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I reviewed your list again and other than I met Michael's "Squeeze", Frances, I knew none of the others. But you are familiar with the name "Archie" Nelson right? He was a near constant companion and partner of John LaRocca's in the carwash John owned. If I'm not mistaken, the carwash was actually named "Archie's Carwash." I suspect that Archie was close to Mike Genovese also over the years. How could he not be right? Mike was John's partner and sidekick. It seems Archie was a hoodlum too, had a police record, and was active in the numbers racket (I'm sure in conjunction with Mike, etc).
Last edited by NYMafia; 01/03/23 10:23 AM.
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Re: 73 Confidential FBI "Mafia" Informers Revealed!
[Re: NYMafia]
#1047224
01/03/23 10:43 AM
01/03/23 10:43 AM
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Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 817
Friend_of_Henry
Underboss
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Underboss
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 817
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Believe me I have no doubt that your list is spot on, but if I never met or even knew the guy then I can't comment on what I don't know.
"Never walk in a room that you don't know how to get out of"- Henry Zottola
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Re: 73 Confidential FBI "Mafia" Informers Revealed!
[Re: NYMafia]
#1047228
01/03/23 11:08 AM
01/03/23 11:08 AM
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Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 817
Friend_of_Henry
Underboss
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Underboss
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 817
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You would expect a "Punch Drunk" boxer to keep his mouth shut :-)
"Never walk in a room that you don't know how to get out of"- Henry Zottola
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Re: 73 Confidential FBI "Mafia" Informers Revealed!
[Re: NYMafia]
#1047230
01/03/23 11:36 AM
01/03/23 11:36 AM
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Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 817
Friend_of_Henry
Underboss
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Underboss
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 817
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Fair enough - Shit Happens!
"Never walk in a room that you don't know how to get out of"- Henry Zottola
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Re: 73 Confidential FBI "Mafia" Informers Revealed!
[Re: dsd]
#1047252
01/04/23 04:27 PM
01/04/23 04:27 PM
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Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 12,482
NYMafia
OP
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OP
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 12,482
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What sort of info would Graziano, the boxer, have on mob types ? Don't know anything about the guy, who were his mob pals?
I can imagine guys wanting there picture taken with hin, have dinner etc. Probably guys dropping names to impress him. Rocky Graziano's real name was Rocco Barbella. He grew up Downtown, around the Little Italy section of Manhattan. He knew everybody, or nearly everybody. He was a street kid, a hoodlum, growing up. Had he not gone into boxing, he would have certainly stayed gravitated to the hoodlum life. So he had some very close close friends who were top wise guys. He also had many enemies and guys he didn't like, or didn't like him, growing up. So potentially, he had a lot to gab about if thats the way he wanted to go!
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Re: 73 Confidential FBI "Mafia" Informers Revealed!
[Re: NYMafia]
#1047258
01/04/23 05:14 PM
01/04/23 05:14 PM
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Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 817
Friend_of_Henry
Underboss
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Underboss
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 817
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Yeah, at the end of the day Sam gave them "Squat"!
"Never walk in a room that you don't know how to get out of"- Henry Zottola
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Re: 73 Confidential FBI "Mafia" Informers Revealed!
[Re: craigs48]
#1047338
01/05/23 07:28 AM
01/05/23 07:28 AM
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Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 12,482
NYMafia
OP
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OP
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 12,482
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I think the car wash was called Allegheny Car Wash. It was near the Rosa Villa on Sandusky street. I might have a picture. The original carwash was owned by Archie Nelson and Mike Genovese, who were partners in this business venture. I believe that John LaRocca was also in for a piece of the profits of this business (possibly off the books). They named it Archie's Automatic Carwash, and it was located at 8050 Bennett Street, Pittsburgh. Aside from Archie who oversaw the business, they installed a fellow named Ed Morante as manager, and another guy, Samuel (Big Sam) Russo, a former bartender, in as an assistant manager. This Alleghany Carwash you mention may have been their's years later also, but the original business was named after Archie Nelson. Informants said the original funding for the carwash venture (over $100,000, which was a lot of money in those days), came from profits Archie and Mike made in the numbers business which they then reinvested.
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Re: 73 Confidential FBI "Mafia" Informers Revealed!
[Re: Friend_of_Henry]
#1047341
01/05/23 09:00 AM
01/05/23 09:00 AM
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Joined: May 2017
Posts: 261
Millspgh
Capo
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Capo
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 261
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Yeah, at the end of the day Sam gave them "Squat"! Agree FOH, he never testified, and mainly told them about the getting made ceremony and structure. Here is how it was described in one article and this is very accurate: "Mannarino seems to have engaged in conversation with federal agents mostly out of boredom and a slight sense of disappointment over the abrupt end to his criminal life. His revelations to the agents never went very far, but he did shed light on his criminal past and the history of the Pittsburgh Crime Family to a degree that probably would have gotten him in trouble with his superiors if it had leaked out. He never tried to jam up any of his former criminal associates and he never revealed anything that would put him in the category of a full-fledged informant."
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Re: 73 Confidential FBI "Mafia" Informers Revealed!
[Re: NYMafia]
#1047452
01/06/23 01:43 PM
01/06/23 01:43 PM
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Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 1,529
Bensonhurst, Brooklyn, NYC
BensonHURST
Bensonhurst
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Bensonhurst
Underboss
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 1,529
Bensonhurst, Brooklyn, NYC
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So the thing with ALOT of informants back then.
So at the time the feds and their various agencies and appearantly some state agencies as well.
Due to the fact that they knew NOTHING about LCN,
They employed a strategy specifically the “ TOP ECHELON INFORMER” program.
To where as the feds would offer a lot for guys to talk, almost anything they needed was on the table.
Look at Scarpa and Bulger.
It appears the Feds would open up a file on anyone thy would talk to them about anything.
A lot got nothing in return.
So let’s say you were Carlo Gambino’s barber and they approached you and you took the time and sit down and talk and just give info on Carlo, even though had nothing to do with O.C. activity they would open up a file on you.
Which is really unfair because when it came out even though it was never supposed and that’s why they are so tight lipped, people can die, people have died.
Read the rat trap files to get an understanding of what I mean.
He lists ALOT of actual files and you can see that a lot of these “INFORMANTS” gave them NOTHING.
The feds had a profile as to who to target and what to offer them.
These feds courted some of these guys for years and years, trying to get them to open up.
I think part of the process was to first gain the LCN guys trust, first get them talking about nothing, eventually they would feel comfortable and give out info on LCN.
Again if you sat with them and talked about B.S. stuff of no value, they would give you an informants #.
On the hopes that this guy might need the feds for something and the fed would try to relieved and now the LCN guy owed him.
It was DIRTY, DIRTY what the Feds did.
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Re: 73 Confidential FBI "Mafia" Informers Revealed!
[Re: BensonHURST]
#1047457
01/06/23 02:29 PM
01/06/23 02:29 PM
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Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 12,482
NYMafia
OP
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OP
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 12,482
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So the thing with ALOT of informants back then.
So at the time the feds and their various agencies and appearantly some state agencies as well.
Due to the fact that they knew NOTHING about LCN,
They employed a strategy specifically the “ TOP ECHELON INFORMER” program.
To where as the feds would offer a lot for guys to talk, almost anything they needed was on the table.
Look at Scarpa and Bulger.
It appears the Feds would open up a file on anyone thy would talk to them about anything.
A lot got nothing in return.
So let’s say you were Carlo Gambino’s barber and they approached you and you took the time and sit down and talk and just give info on Carlo, even though had nothing to do with O.C. activity they would open up a file on you.
Which is really unfair because when it came out even though it was never supposed and that’s why they are so tight lipped, people can die, people have died.
Read the rat trap files to get an understanding of what I mean.
He lists ALOT of actual files and you can see that a lot of these “INFORMANTS” gave them NOTHING.
The feds had a profile as to who to target and what to offer them.
These feds courted some of these guys for years and years, trying to get them to open up.
I think part of the process was to first gain the LCN guys trust, first get them talking about nothing, eventually they would feel comfortable and give out info on LCN.
Again if you sat with them and talked about B.S. stuff of no value, they would give you an informants #.
On the hopes that this guy might need the feds for something and the fed would try to relieved and now the LCN guy owed him.
It was DIRTY, DIRTY what the Feds did.
You're partially correct in that FBI agents, after they interview somebody, ALWAYS write what's called a #302 report, documenting the alleged conversation and give and take they had with that person. Some, in fact many, guys who gave up even somewhat innocuous information were provided confidential T numbers with various codes, etc. to identify them. But there were also many, many guys (important guys) who provided valuable intel. Some did it on a short term basis. Others, did it steadily over years, providing inside info on LCN and other top racket guys. Think Greg Scarpa, Alfredo Sanantonio, etc.
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