In Part I, Michael has Fabrizzio translate for him to Apollonia's father. I realise FFC had him do this because Al Pacino could not talk Sicilian. But earlier in the film he talks Italian with Sollozzo. Are the two languages spoken in this scene different (ie. are Sicilian and Italian two different languages?) It just seems odd that Pacino would trouble himself to learn so much Italian for the Sollozzo scene nd then speak English for the Thunderbolt scene.

And then in Part II, when Fanucci comes into Abbandando's Grocery, why does Genco sart to explain to Vito what is happening? Can't Vito hear or understand what Fanucci is saying? Are there different dialects within the Sicilian language? Any insight would be much appreciated. THanks in advance.

Mick

Pacino really didn't speak much Italian in the restaurant scene. It was Sollozzo doing all the talking, except for a few clumsy words here & there from Michael.

His asking Fabrizio to translate to Appolonia's father was out of courtesy, because he knew he could state his intentions better in English and Fabrizio being fluent in both languages was the perfect one to assist.

However, in that later scene in GFII, where he's talking with his mother, Michael seems to be doing pretty well with Italian, though he still appears to be reaching for words. Of mama spoke English...but I think FFC did this purposely to give the moment more of a 'family' feel to it. More like this was a lost man not really knowing what to do next.

As for the grocery scene, Genco is not really translating Fanucci's words, but filling Vito in on what's been going on (cracking down on the neighborhood, people aren't paying, etc.). Obviously Vito can understand Fanucci, because they later have at least two conversations. When Fanucci stops the car, and then when Vito meets him with the $$$ during the Feast.

Apple

I always had the impression that Michael didn't speak Italian as fluently as his parents, yet I assume Vito did. When he had Fabrizzio translate, I assumed that he just wanted to make sure the translation was perfect, and didn't feel totally comfortable speaking it.

Then when talking to mama, as Apple pointed out, he seemed to do okay. I attribute that to the fact that he was speaking to family and felt more comfortable. Perhaps too, since Michael seemed to want to move away from some of the old traditions, he didn't try that hard to perfect his Italian.

TIS

But why wouldn't Vito know about Fanucci? He had lived in the neighbourhood for sixtenn years--and he hadn't come across the man?

And Michael talking with Fabrizzio translating is I think purely down to Pacino's lack of fluent Italian; why would Michael want to speak English and risk letting word get out that there was an English speaking paisan in town (and thus expose himself to possible attacks from those looking for him)?

Mick

I believe Michael had Fabrizio translate to make an impression on Sr. Vitelli, Apollonia's father. First, he wanted to show him that he wasn't just a simple peasant--he was enough of a padrone to have someone in his employ to translate for him. Take a gander at the look that settles on Michael's face--he looks imperious, boss-like, not unlike the look he had in his office in GFII after Senator Geary made the "oily hair" speech. Second, he wanted to reinforce the impression that he was an American, not a Sicilian, which would help smooth over the gaffe he had committed by talking about Sr. Vitelli's daughter.
As for Fanucci: Young Vito surely knew who Fanucci was, and what his reputation was. But young Vito made a habit of keeping quiet, so even his pal Genco couldn't be sure of what he did and didn't know. In a deleted scene, Vito, making a delivery, witnessed two young punks cutting Fanucci's throat.

As a half sicilian myself (on my father's side), I can at least answer the questions about the sicilian language, which actually is an italian dialect. BTW, I speak italian fluently and I understand and speak a little sicilian (seeing my relatives in Siciliy almost every year).

The sicilian dialect is significantly different from, let's say "clean" italian. It contains a lot of words deriving from spanish and french, even some arabic. An italian from the northern part would hardly understand a word.

However, not all italian actors in the movie speak sicilian. It's basically some kinda southern coloured italian with a few sicilian expressions. The beginning of Part 2 is a good example for real sicilian, though (even if it sounds a little "learned" at parts). For example they tell young vito "Nun ti scandare" for "Don't be afraid", instead of (italian) "Non avere paura". Or "picciliddru" instead of "bambino" (kid). This should show you how different the two languages are!

There are even sub-dialects in the different sicilian provinces (towns). They, however, differ from each other mostly in the pronounciation (melody).

I hope I could help!

Greets

Don Lanzarone

Welcome DL! Man, that is really cool! I'm half Italian and I only know the swear words!

Welcome, Don Lanzarone. That was very helpful!
Another graphic example of Sicilian dialect is found in the opera scene in GFIII. At the very beginning, Anthony sings the famous "Siciliana" aria, which contains many unique words in dialect. A sure giveaway is the Sicilian use of the final vowel "u" instead of the "a" or "e" in non-dialect Italian.

Thanks for the welcome, lil mafioso!

I'll try to visit this forum more often in the future, so I could teach you the one other italian or sicilian expression!

Si ci na cosa, unni ti puezzu aiutari, nun scandarti di chiedermillu!
(If there's something, where I can help you, don't be afraid to ask me!)

Welcome Don Lanzorone!! I too am from a Sicilian family but regretfully don't speak the language (just words here and there).

I don't know if it's dialect or not, but my entire family and relatives pronounce Pasta with a "B" sound instead of a "P". They spell it with the "P", but it's always "Basta" instead of "Posta". I do know they will also say "BaSTA, meaning something totally different, like maybe "shut up"? Do you know what I am talking about?

TIS

TIS, "basta" means "enough" in Italian -- Maybe they were saying, "hey! that's enough! save some for us!!"

Yeah, "basta" means "enough".

The sicilian dialect doesn't use very hard consonants, so a single "p" in the beginning of a word sounds more like a "b". In addition to that, the letters "st", like in "Pasta" or "basta", become a "sht", so it's pronounced either way as "bashta".

BTW: Does anyone know how and where to apply for a part in "Godfather IV"?

I'm sorry I don't know, but if you find out, let us know. I think all of us on the board haved "earned" at least a spot as an "extra". Wouldn't that be a kick??

TIS

Welcome, Don Lanzarone, your initial post in this thread was very helpful. Thank you!

Mick

Very cool we have a Sicilian here to tell us these things! Welcome!

"Basta" - I will have to remember that!

Actually, it's a little beyond just being a dialect. Since Sicily was invaded by so many cultures, the language there took a life of its own and some linguists feel it's different enough to actually be a language of its own.

As far as your original question, Michael doesn't speak Sicilian very well, as you can see when he becomes frustrated at the meeting with Sollozzo when he can't find the right words and starts to speak English. I also agree with Turnbull that having the translator gave him a sense of authority with Appollonia's father. However, he spent a long time in Sicily and I would imagine his skill of the language would've improved, as evidenced in the scene with Mama in GF2.

...And the rest were complete crap?

j/k, welcome Don Lanzarone!