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A misconception?
#1007025
03/12/21 04:55 AM
03/12/21 04:55 AM
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Joined: Aug 2020
Posts: 91 Adelaide, Australia
lucab19
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One of the things I think people get wrong about the Solozzo-Michael sit down is that they suddenly start speaking English, In the presence of McCluskey, no less.
I believe this is wrong. Sure, we the viewers see this happen but it's just a device used by the director because this is the section of the conversation, indeed the only section of the conversation that he wants us to hear directly.
What do we see/hear? Michael's imploring Solozzo: "What I want -- what's most important to me -- is that I have a guarantee: No more attempts on my father's life." Remember how he struggles to find the words, just as he did in the Italian section.
Then there's Solozzo's reply: "What guarantees could I give you ... You think too much of me, kid -- I'm not that clever ... " Especially the smug, self-satisfied way Solozzo delivers his reply. He really thinks Mike is a weakling and that he is going to crush him and his family. Of course we know exactly what is going to happen, and it just makes Solozzo's comeuppance that much more satisfying.
Also, I believe that if Michael had actually started speaking English Solozzo would have shut him down in an instant. Because of McCluskey. Sure, they're allies now but who's to say their relationship wouldn't sour in the future. (I realise this is moot given the outcome) It was Solozzo who decided they would speak Italian in the first place and it would be he who would decide otherwise.
This is a fairly common film device used by directors to show that the character is still speaking his native language, but the switch to English is simply a viewer aid. Two examples of major films involve Sean Connery in The Hunt for Red October, and Tom Cruise in Valkyrie.
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Re: A misconception?
[Re: lucab19]
#1007031
03/12/21 09:38 AM
03/12/21 09:38 AM
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 1,474 No. Virginia
mustachepete
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You may be right. It's certainly a device that gets used in movies.
My own impression is that this is where Michael starts throwing off the passive role he's been handed. He's gotten into a car where he's outnumbered, endured a little pat on the shoulder from McCluskey, been frisked, and subjected to the Jersey maneuver. And he just had to sit and take it. So, switching to English is where he stops being passive, forces Sollozzo to yield a little control, and starts building the adrenaline he's going to need to kill the other two.
I don't think either of the Italians are giving McCluskey much consideration at this point. They've taken their measure of him, and decided that he has no personal force.
Last edited by mustachepete; 03/12/21 09:40 AM.
"All of these men were good listeners; patient men."
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Re: A misconception?
[Re: lucab19]
#1008887
04/02/21 05:54 PM
04/02/21 05:54 PM
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Joined: Aug 2018
Posts: 16
Bussetta
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Wiseguy
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So I viewed this a little different. I just saw Michael switching to English because he could better articulate what he wanted to say.
And for context, I had a similar upbringing to Michael in that I was raised in the US by immigrants whose second language is English. So I spoke a mix of English and a second language, but my "native language" is English.
When I communicate with my parents, they switch between English and their native language back and forth in the middle of conversation.
Since Michael had to have a conversation in a language that didn't seem to be his "native language," I just thought he switched to English in this instance because it was easier for him.
There are a lot of times in the series that there is a mixing of languages, often in the middle of sentences, or just at the most random times (the first instance I can think of is when Michael and Pentangeli are having a conversation in Pentangeli's home and Michael says something about Roth: "He's gonna think our relationship is good, (something Italian)," which Pentangeli repeats.
Not sure if I'm going way off topic here, but it's one of the things I love about the movies, the immigrant experience and how Coppola uses language. It's very authentic to me, as someone who grew up with essentially two cultures.
(For the record I am not Italian so maybe I am completely off on all of this.)
Would love to hear others' thoughts about language and immigrant experiences as seen in the movie, etc.
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Re: A misconception?
[Re: lucab19]
#1008889
04/02/21 06:39 PM
04/02/21 06:39 PM
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 1,474 No. Virginia
mustachepete
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I just saw Michael switching to English because he could better articulate what he wanted to say. A related aspect is that he was recently punched in the mouth. In the book his jaw is wired. I'm not sure if that's so in the movie, but part of spitting out, "What I want.." seems to be that he's having trouble talking at all.
"All of these men were good listeners; patient men."
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Re: A misconception?
[Re: Bussetta]
#1008931
04/03/21 03:58 PM
04/03/21 03:58 PM
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Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 19,720 AZ
Turnbull
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Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 19,720
AZ
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Would love to hear others' thoughts about language and immigrant experiences as seen in the movie, etc.
In II, when young Vito comes through Immigration on Ellis Island, the officer asks his name. Vito doesn't answer, so another officer reads his name, "Vito Andolini from Corleone." The first guy says, "Vito Corleone. Next..." That's his name for the rest of his life. That happened in the same kind of way in my family. My father's father was an immigrant. He had a polysyllabic last name, but the immigration officer heard only the first syllable--and that became our family name in America.
Ntra la porta tua lu sangu � sparsu, E nun me mporta si ce muoru accisu... E s'iddu muoru e vaju mparadisu Si nun ce truovo a ttia, mancu ce trasu.
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Re: A misconception?
[Re: lucab19]
#1009062
04/05/21 12:27 PM
04/05/21 12:27 PM
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Joined: May 2006
Posts: 773 Pittsburgh, PA
The Last Woltz
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Joined: May 2006
Posts: 773
Pittsburgh, PA
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Somehow, a nickname one of my ancestors had in the old country became my great-grandmother's family name here in America.
One benefit is that I've actually twice realized that new acquaintances were actually distant cousins, since we know anyone with that name must be related.
"A man in my position cannot afford to be made to look ridiculous!"
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