Vito and Michael were very powerful men. But, what did they do with the power they achieved?

I believe that for Vito, power was a means to an end: security and a free hand to control his family and businesses. In Sicily, he’d witnessed a two-bit gabellotto wipe out his father, brother and mother—and nearly wiped him out—with a wave of his hand. In America, a two-bit Black Hander demanded a big share of his take of a dress factory robbery that he’d risked life and liberty for. He’d never let that happen again.

His money bought him the power to control those around him, and to buy police and political protection for his businesses. But, he never lived big. His “Mall” in Long Beach was a formidable property, but it was more a fortress where he surrounded himself with family and retainers than a mansion or an estate. It seemed pretty ordinary on the inside, no fancy furniture or chandeliers. He didn’t flaunt his money—the only time we see him dressed in anything other plain shirt and pants is at Connie’s wedding and at the Commission meeting.

He knew he could never be considered “legitimate” in society, but it was enough for him to be respected and honored by those whom he helped and did business with. Vito summarized himself succinctly for Michael: “I work my whole life, I don't apologize, to take care of my family. And I refused -- to be a fool -- dancing on the string, held by all those -- bigshots. I don't apologize -- that's my life” [emphasis added].

For Michael, power seemed to be its own end—once he had power he never stopped trying to get more. He lived lavishly and publicly in Nevada—his party for Anthony at his gigantic, showy estate, and his thousands of guests, was the exact opposite of Vito’s modest, anonymous lifestyle. He wasn’t content to be the biggest power in US gambling—legal and illegal—he had to have Klingman’s share of the Tropigala Hotel, and he wanted all of Roth’s Havana holdings. He let nothing stand in his way—having a hooker killed to blackmail Geary, attempting to murder Roth to get his holdings.

You could argue that all of his wealth and power served his obsession with becoming “legitimate.” In III, he had achieved legitimacy --he sold his gambling interests, had been made a Papal Knight, and founded a gigantic philanthropy. But he still wants more—he wants the controlling interest in Immobiliare because, as Archbishop Gilday says, “it can make you one of the richest men in the world.” And, he’s still controlling the Commission—as Vincent tells him, “I know you’re into banks and Wall Street, but everyone knows you’re the final word, you’re like the Supreme Court.” And he’s keeping Zasa from rising in the Commission. Nothing satisfies him.

“Just when I thought I was out, they pull me back in,” he complains after the Atlantic City attack. Yeah, sure—he was never out, never wanted to be out.

Your thoughts?

TB, You left out the most important part of that quote - the quote, in its entirety gives us the reason, I believe.

"This deal with Immobiliare can make you one of the richest men in the world. Your whole past history, and the history of your family, will be washed away."

Michael's driving ambition was his quest for legitimacy, as much as the accumulation of power. An obviously futile ambition, of course, but it certainly drove him.

Michael was definitely more power hungry, paranoid, and ruthless. I think Vito had much more respect bestowed on him because even though he can also be ruthless he was seen as more fair

Yes. I left off the second part of the quote because it's part of another agenda: Gilday's sleazy attempt to get Michael to save his ass by bailing out the Vatican Bank. Michael's face is impassive, his gaze is skeptical: His sins had already been washed away when the Pope made him a Knight of St. Sebastian--why else would he have invited the press to witness to his celebratory party, with a briefing by young Abbandando? Even after being blessed by the Pope, and despite his hundreds of millions of dollars of net worth, Michael still wanted more: more money and more power through the Immobiliare deal.--and more leverage over the Vatican through the bailout...he never stopped.

Sure thing lucab19 in its entirety: So who wouldn't?! especially the former head of the most powerful Mafia family, wash away his nefarious history and for only Six hundred million!

Michael had achieved "legitimacy" and accumulated immense power and wealth indeed and realised his ambition or rather the semblance of the "legitimacy" it ever going to be....

We saw how Michael was “respected and honored” by all those Senators and business people fawning! over him at the Superman club
Senator attended Michael's son's party in his home - not so for Vito's daughter's wedding

Michael like father like son Same as Vito, the enemies have to be wiped out
However Times were changing Also Vito's Criminality and Michael's “legitimacy”

• Vito

Vito enjoyed the power and fear that he wielded “to control” - among others, just ask!
1. Signor Roberto, Carmela's friend's landlord
2. Don Ciccio, one leg in the grave
3. band leader's brains or his signature
4. Woltz via Khartoum [defenceless prize horse]
5. anybody about killing machine Luca, Vito's most valued friend

Vito was instrumental, contributed and caused the misery of every one of his children to their gloom and doom including the violent deaths of Sonny and Fredo Thanks! Pop

Here's the thing Extracts:but burdened Michael with Vito's goal for Michael to be “legitimate” in society” and Michael's driving force and obsession “to be the biggest power in US [and Havana] gambling —legal and illegal” Bigger than US Steel Thanks! Pop

Vito's "to be respected and honored by those whom he helped” - always with a caveat
Paulie and Tessio still betrayed Vito. Carlo when Vito was in Hospital recovering from hit with five shots

• Michael

That is the Good Business Practice of powerful and successful people They never stop

Vito had a huge wedding for Connie not dissimilar to Anthony's party
Michael too “surrounded himself with family and retainers” Mama, Tom, Fredo and Connie to come and live on his estate with her kids
Neri, Rocco....

Vito -- where is the fairness? - comply with his “justice” or die

• band leader

The band leader couldn't benefit after building up Fontane's career probably from an unknown, to a star and the band leader's brains would have been on the contract if he hadn't signed off Fontane's release

• Woltz

Woltz was forced to cast the actor he never wanted for his movie, making him look ridiculous! and Woltz' head would have been.... if Fontane hadn't got the part in Woltz' movie

• Geary

after Geary's squeeze and insults “—having a hooker killed [deplorable and Tom too] to blackmail Geary”

Was Michael bloodthirsty?

• Roth

In fairness, Michael was not “attempting to murder Roth to get his holdings” Michael was negotiating in Good Faith

It was Roth who was attempting to murder Michael after stringing Michael along as his son and successor and Roth's murder was only after Roth's attempt to machine gun Michael down

Once a common Mafia hood -- Michael can never be out!

Lana, that is true - but Senator Geary clearly held Michael in utter contempt, as evidenced by this exchange:


GEARY
Yeah, well let's cut out the bull---t. I don't want to spend any more time here than I have to. You can have the license, the price is 250,000 dollars. Plus a monthly payment of 5% of the gross -- of all four hotels. Mister -- Corleone. {he said his name in a mocking Italian accent}

MICHAEL
Now the price of the license is less than 20,000 dollars, am I right?

GEARY
That's right.

MICHAEL
Now why would I ever consider paying more than that?

GEARY
Because I intend to squeeze you. I don't like your kind of people. I don't like to see you come out to this clean country in your oily hair -- dressed up in those silk suits - and try to pass yourselves off as decent Americans. I'll do business with you, but the fact is, I despise your masquerade -- the dishonest way you pose yourself. Yourself, and your whole f--king family.


I maintain that his quest for (real) legitimacy was driving him.

I reckon, the family under Michael was "legitimate" he had achieved the semblance of the "legitimacy" it ever going to be.... successful businessman, philanthropist and as We see in GFIII more "legitimate" than ever

Michael's "legitimate" front was the Elephant in the room and as we saw people were not treating him as crime boss to his face and going along with it -- Senator attending Anthony's party, Mr. Wonderful by the Sierra Boys Choir, Plaque, Roth's birthday party, Superman club

Who didn't know who Michael's father was? Who Michael is?
New York City police Captain and a man named Virgil Sollozzo -- Yeah, I heard that story....
Baptism massacre No secret


Nevadan Senator Geary's arrogance and hubris: Untouchable decent American family man visiting brothels and squeeze
Vito too would have copped the same squeeze and insults from him

Slippery Geary thought he was too smart to let Michael beat him and nearly pulled it off too.
1. kept him totally in the dark about his upcoming Senate hearing
2. the ambiguous rotten apples speech
3. conveniently excusing himself

. Definitely was not legitimate it was more of a bullshit excuse he would use. It took another 20 years for him to finally try to go legitimate

he had achieved legitimacy -- was respected and honored
In II, Senator attending Anthony's party, Mr. Wonderful by the Sierra Boys Choir, Plaque, Roth's birthday party, Superman club
In III, founded a gigantic philanthropy. Pope made him a Knight of St. Sebastian. blessed by the Pope.

Bigger than US Steel

Otherwise Neri will take them fishing! Klingman -- Yeah, I heard that story....

Once a common Mafia hood --

• Godfather III

Sure thing spin doctor -- for six hundred million!

When Tom called upon Bonasera to do his service for Vito

in the novel:
Amerigo Bonasera felt the coffee churning sourly in his stomach, felt himself going a little sick.
It was more than a year since he had put himself in the debt of the Don to avenge his daughter’s honor and in that time the knowledge that he must pay that debt had receded.

Now Bonasera felt the sickness of a man faced with disaster. He waited with a feeling of the utmost despair.

Bonasera was pretty clueless when it came to Vito.
First,he insults him by asking how much Vito would charge to avenge his daughter's assault, as if he was a goon for hire.
To make it worse,he does it in front of other people,and on Connie's wedding day.
In the novel, when Bonasera gets the call from Tom,he conjures up all kinds of scenarios for the "service" he is to repay.
He thinks that he will be asked to get rid of a body, or somehow be forced into doing "Mafia" business.
He gets really worked up.
Turns out that all Vito was asking was for Bonasera to do what he does every day,namely prepare a body for viewing.
His "feeling of utmost despair" was unfounded,but understandable,given his preconceived notions about Vito.

t
The interplay between Vito and Bonasera is what makes this one of the most powerful opening of any movie ever made. Those first four words--"I believe in America"--set Bonasera's ideal of the "American Dream" against his need for the justice denied him by his adopted country--and Vito's ability to give him justice in the old fashioned, Sicilian way that he needs now. It's a marvel to watch Bonasera trying to reconcile the two by turning Vito into a gun-for-hire--and Vito's patient but pointed explaining that the justice he seeks is paid for by friendship, respect and honor, not money. "You found paradise in America: you had a good trade, made a good living, the police protected you, and there were courts of law.. You didn't need a man like me." When Bonasera finally capitulates, kissing Vito's hand, we have, right at the beginning of the movie, a very clear idea of what Vito is about. Bravo!

and called him Godfather

Michael like father like son, in Denial and Delusional. Geary too and their masquerade

• Vito

comply with his “justice” or die

• Michael

Michael's statement before the Senate committee "clearing his family name" to put it in the record

• Geary

Nevadan Senator Geary's arrogance and hubris: Untouchable decent American family man visiting brothels “we'd done it before” but....
Senator, same as your masquerade -- the dishonest way you pose yourself

Michael like father like son, in every way Criminal and Blood family

The difference was their wives. Carmela you can never lose your family Kay murdered theirs

. Totally disagree. Even Mike realized later on that he destroyed the family

Carmela's love, loyalty and support for Vito was unconditional and she took care of their blood family without asking Vito about his business unlike Michael's horror wife Kay

Biggest Hypocrite Kay enjoying the spoils of the tainted money from other people's blood, misery and murder, funding her rich and privileged life until the Tahoe bedroom shooting when it suddenly dawned! on her this unholy and evil Sicilian thing that's been going on for 2,000 years must all stop

Also worth noting when
1. Vito and Carmela married, Vito was a law abiding store employee
2. Michael and Kay married, Kay knew Michael was Mafia

. Completely False. Before the shooting she clearly said “You said the family would be completely legitimate in 5 years that was 7 years ago”

True Lana Biggest Hypocrite Kay enjoying the spoils of the unholy and evil Sicilian thing, funding her rich and privileged life

"legitimate" -- I mean not now, but ah five, seven, ten years from now still the same tainted money from other people's blood, misery and murder from his involvements with the underworld to Las Vegas gambling

She murdered their unborn son She is no different. in Denial and Delusional too her masquerade But never think it applies to Kay

Oh -- who's being naïve

. Obviously I don’t agree with her aborting the baby. However she did love Mike and believed him when he said he was legitimizing the family. She underestimated how evil Mike had become

Exactly Evita whilst Michael, once a common Mafia hood -- had achieved "legitimacy" and accumulated immense power and wealth indeed and realised his ambition or rather the semblance of the "legitimacy" it ever going to be.... It is still the same tainted money

Kay murdered their truly innocent, defenseless unborn son to spite her husband How unholy and evil is that
My take, Kay didn't even see their unborn son as living, her own flesh and blood as well -- calling their unborn son it -- a tool to use, to commit murder, to spite his father

Oh -- Who is blind

I don't agree with Kay's decision to have an abortion, but it's absurd to blame her more than Mike. His faults are endlessly bigger than hers. If you think Kay is an evil hypocrite, then Mike is a heartless monster without redeeming qualities, no matter how he is trying to paint himself. It's like comparing a mosquito to a man-eating tiger (maybe not the most accurate comparison, but you get my point).

Where does it say Kay blamed more than Mike
What comparison? What point