so post carlisi tenure as BOSS we could be looking at an admin setup of...

( jan.3 1997-

BOSS
JOHN MONTELEONE

advisor ( similar to 'chairman' position or consigliere, a senior respected voice. )
JOHN DIFRONZO

UNDERBOSS ( possible he is in control or supervising both elmwood park and grand ave crews? )
JOSEPH ANDRIACCHI

advisor ( same role as DIFRONZO. )
Melrose Park crew
Leader
Alphonse Tornabene

i wont go into detail of full admin but a question on monteleone. even as BOSS would he have maintained control of both 26th street and cicero crews? would all crews, minus perhaps melrose park fall under authority of UB andriacchi?

thanks for answer above as well TD.

You're welcome Vito.

I would also add or change (my personal opinion) that Tornabene was capo for the Carlisi/Marcello crew during those days, and also probably had direct contact with the top admin, meaning I believe that he possibly became "senior advisor" after his tenure as acting boss during 2001/2003, or from 2003/04 until his death in 2009.

For those who wonder regarding the "senior advisor" term, well the old Outfit never used the traditional term "consigleri", but instead they had a similar spot that was reserved for several individuals, such as former bosses and "capo squadroni" who still received both illegal and legal income from their own crews which they previously controlled.

When Monteleone became boss, his Chinatown crew was headed by Toots Caruso and the Cicero crew was under Spano Sr. As Spano once allegedly said, Monteleone was his boss and also boss of the whole Outfit, meaning even the MP/Cicero crew.

yeah i think thats an important distinction between what the outfit bosses used as counsel as opposed to some other families. monteleone could have had at his disposal for advice; difronzo, tornabene and even potentially for a time angelo lapietra, although it seems lapietra was fairly sick 1997-1999 death. i'm sure other family bosses went for advice to other senior members outside the official consigliere position on all kinds of matters, but with monteleone and the outfit it would appear he relied on difronzo and tornabene specifically.

during this monteleone era the leadership had some big decisions to make. someone or someones ordered the hit on ronnie jarrett in 1999.
the outfit as a whole was reeling from indictment after indictment in the mid 1990s as well as losing power in both LIUNA and teamster locals. certainly wasnt just monteleone dealing with all this turmoil in a bubble.
anthony chiaramonti gets released in 1998 and quickly gets to work for melrose park crew, similar to mike sarno being released in 1999. what territory are they allotted if any? who do they report to etc.
as we get closer to 2000s and the rise of marcello, how was his elevation going to be handled on the street by his crew, was his ascension only at time of monteleones death?
who would assume mantle in acting capacity upon monteleones death. the consensus being tornabene as has been said above and elsewhere.
also there is the indicments of very profitable cicero crew led by mike spano sr in july 2000 and centracchio in may 1999, then again in apr 2000. these 2 leaders, whose official title is up for debate were none the less running very profitable rackets. who would be charged with replacing them and assuming their territory.

i could go on but just a few examples across chicago and crews where we can see the need for a boss to have more than one advisor depending on the crew and situation.

i left tornabene as leader only because we dont really know what his title was officially. we know the crew and that he was a respected leader in it so i left it at that.

Thats right, the Outfit had its own "board of directors" and also "counsel" which ruled over the whole organization by making policies and rules that kept the order and peace among the rest of the membership and associates. Also, yes there were also some lower level members who were quite influential and mentored many future bosses and capos. Old time mobster Johnny DeBiase (EP) and younger Joey Lombardo (Grand) comes to mind but they usually "advised" members from their own crew or group, while the senior advisor had the power to advise all reps from each crew. For example, Ricca and Accardo advised and mentored bosses who in turn came from different crews, such as Giancana from Taylor St, Battaglia from MP and Grand, or Cerone from EP, or even Aiuppa from the Cicero/MP crew. Besides having the last word on all union matters, during his prime, non-Italian leader and representative Murray Humphreys also advised almost every high level member.

The Cicero/South Side group was trigger happy since the days of Giancana, Fat Lenny Caifano and Buccieri, meaning it doesnt suprise me regarding their involvement in the murders from 90s and 2000s. Both Monteleone and Sarno personally witnessed the murderous regimes of Buccieri, Torello, the LaPietras and Ferriola, and so I believe that pulling the trigger wasnt a problem for them. On the other hand, crews like the EP/Grand group were more business oriented, not that they didnt have their own killers, but still they were far from what was the old Monteleone/Sarno coalition.

The old Taylor St/Cicero crew also had interests on the North Side around Lake County, and obviously around the west side and north Cicero, meaning they still didnt have anything around Chinatown and the South Side. Not until Ferraro's death in 1964 and when Gus Alex brought in Buccieri around the Loop and South Side, so he can help the former First Ward/South Side crew with their collections, obviously because Buccieri had the muscle and also took his own cut. As I already stated in one of my previous posts, the Buccieri crew had a huge desire to enter the south side and all southern suburbs, and the situation with Alex was the starting point and the closure was when Buccieri's lieutenant LaPietra entered Chinatown as the new capo for that same area and crew, followed by the "deaths" of both former Chi Heights and First Ward crews during the early 90s.

When Chiaramonti came out of jail, Monteleone's group already had almost every interest around the south, and it seems that Tornabene didnt have any problem with it, but his lieutenant Chiaramonti obviously did and was later eliminated, probably also with the ok from his boss aka capo, including from the imprisoned Marcello.This means that Tornabene's rise after Monteleone's death was probably because he "protected" the interests that belonged to the leading Cicero/Chinatown group. Dont forget that the Aiuppa/Carlisi/Tornabene crew or the Cicero/MP crew also had their interests around the south side since the days of Ralph Capone, but as the decades passed by the situation obviously changed. So, neither Tornabene or DiFronzo didnt want any problems with the Cicero/Chinatown group and thats how they kept the peace to an extent, thus receiving respect from them. Although if the Family Secrets trials never occurred, it is questionable on whether Marcello and Zizzo were going to keep the peace or start a war.

So, as you already stated, Sarno was fresh out of jail in 1999, followed by the indictments and imprisonments of Cicero's leadership such as Spano Sr., and also Monteleone's death in 2001, This means that Toots Caruso was the only high level member or capo for the South Side group who was still free on the streets at the time but wasn't powerful enough to go against the rising Tornabene/Marcello/Zizzo crew and so, he and Sarno (Sarno probably inherited Spano's position as Cicero capo) had to "wait" until the Family Secrets trials.

Five crews "died" (the Cicero-MP, First Ward-South Side, and North Side crews, including both Chicago Heights and Indiana crews) and four are allegedly still alive even today such as the Cicero-Chinatown and the Elmwood Park-Grand Avenue crews. The Cicero-Chinatown group expanded their influence around the south and nw Indiana, while the EP-Grand group took over everything around North/West side. In addition, when I say "they took over everything", Im speaking only about the Outfit's interests, not the interests of other ethnic crime groups. Also, the next crew on the "dead list" might be the Cicero crew, but thats just my own speculation.

As for Centracchio, I strongly believe that he was a capo for the Grand crew, meaning he inherited Eboli's former position (mainly because Eboli died unexpectedly) and later was succeeded by Cozzo, who in turn came from a family that was quite connected since the old days and also owned many old mob hangouts. Under Eboli's and Centracchio's regimes, Cozzo previously operated a casino on the Caribbean island of Curacao and had both the power and cash to take over the Grand Av crew, at any given time.

a link to a very basic chart of outfit starting in 1992 i have been working on. had posted one similar a couple weeks back on another thread. this is almost same but with a few changes to both chart and notes. my hope is to continue to do so not necessarily year by year but as administration changes. next one will only cover a timeline from 1993-1994. have at er with criticism, comments etc. these are in no way set in stone but its a start.


https://postimg.cc/ZvSR0JTM

https://postimg.cc/XBkvCtq7

Looks good...do you have any soldier/associate list from that same time period?

i have been working those up as well but for sake of clarity will post separate as to not clutter up page. will focus on crews who had most active membership based on what we know. so i wont have detailed workups for rush st or chicago hts for example.

Thank you Vito! Looking forward to it when you get it put together!

+1

https://postimg.cc/JHZsYkyn

a link to a work up of elmwood park crew in same timeline as first outfit chart (1992). those listed on left starting with joseph difronzo are members/associates reporting to andriacchi but not in crew being led by marco d'amico. and as far as distinguishing who a member of outfit is or isnt, who is only an associate i cant even begin to achieve this. i believe it is important to make a distinction between an outfit member and simply a high ranking 'italian associate' or conversely a 'non-italian associate.' many a discussion has been had on this site and elsewhere about this and it is an important debate but not one im trying o reignite for this thread. for this and any following charts i am simply trying to show most active crews regardless of ethnicity and who they report to.

https://postimg.cc/0z4NPQW7

the 26th street crew, or at least some of it.

Nice list.

The German was a non-Ital but during one short period he allegedly called the shots for the Grand crew (either between Ebolis death and Centeacchios rise, or between Centracchios imprisonment and Cozzos rise, I dont remember all of details). This means that made or not, D'Amico obviously had a lot of power before going to jail, and also after his release. Btw, you can also add Gagliano for EP, including Pete DiFronzo.




Remove Bombacino from the list since he was EP and was killed years before that. Add Monteleone as leader of the Chinatown crew. LaMantia and Calabrese were also direct with their capo. And its Jerry Scalise who belonged to the Cicero crew.

for the elmwood park crew, and following crews i was showing those reporting direct to capos. all difronzo bros were elmwood park, peter though appears to be working direct with john as top aide and messenger to other outfit leaders. i cant find any info showing any close associates to peter, joseph or john, outside of oft mentioned lefty cacciatore, gino marino and joseph bella. however with those 3 there is also a total lack of evidence showing any criminal involvement. cacciatore and marino have been described as john difronzos driver and im coming to believe that is all they did, drive.
i am thinking the same can be said for chris spina, alleged member of grand avenue crew. this guy gets seen driving lombardo around in 1993 on the tax payers dime no less and from that time on spina is glossed as a grand ave member, capo etc. i guess spina could have continued to drive lombardo around, to what or why in 1993 im not sure as lombardo was not active and under parole restrictions. i cant square then how spina, who has never been arrested to my knowledge, for crimes related to the outfit let alone the grand ave crew then becomes over time a crew leader? TD you know as well as i that come the 1990s the info on the outfit starts to dwindle and i can be blamed for searching for names to build charts etc. but with the passage of time i can at least say that spina was NOT an outfit member circa 1992/1993. the more likely explanation is that the chicago outfit found a little known guy (spina) with no record to drive around lombardo so he wouldnt have to worry about being caught with a known convicted criminal then being sent back to prison for violating parole. where did spina even come from? who did he come up under in grand ave crew? i ask because this crew is next for 1992 era charts.

back to gagliano, gary i assume? would he be with messino/fratto/castaldo side as opposed to working in d'amico street crew?

to the 26th street crew.
there was a bombacino indicted and arrested with calabrese crew in 1995. or perhaps he was mentioned in indictment and was already dead, either way doesnt change much to remove from chart.
the lamantia crew? i wont bother with the calabrese sr. prison introduction debate, lamantia was indicted in july 1993 as being the leader of a crew involved in gambling and with the connect to asian gamblers/on leong association. so monteleone was the chinatown crew leader for james lapietra, in effect putting lamantia and his crew below monteleone?

thanks again for discussion TD. it seems those that were interested are no more, which is fine i will press on. for in a few months someone will begin asking these questions a new looking for info and we can steer them to this thread instead of reigniting old debates that get us nowhere or starting new threads etc.
have a good one.

I agree on everything you said, although I think I have some different opinions regarding specific individuals.

First, here are some alleged associates or members of D'Amico's crew from 1989 until 1995/96:

- Marco D'Amico (crew leader)

- Tony Dote (lieutenant)

- Carl Dote (EP/Grand)

- Robert Abbinanti (related to D'Amico)

- Roland Borelli (i think he later turned informant against D'Amico)

- William Tenuta (EP)

- Rick Rissoulo (dont know shit about this guy)

- Frank Catapano (Schiller Park)

- Robert Scutkowski (EP)

At first, D'Amico probably reported to Andriacchi, but when the latter one allegedly became underboss for Monteleone, it is quite possible that Pete DiFronzo became the new capo for the EP crew, followed by his alleged successor Rudy Fratto. Im not sure if Messino was active during the 90s,although he was allegedly D'Amico's mentor. I also think that Messinos kids (or nephews) continued the "tradition" while he remained as literally broke "former" member.

I have similar opinion regarding Gary Gagliano, meaning he either reported to his capo or had direct contact with DiFronzo and Andriacchi, same as Pete and Joe DiFronzo. As for Castaldo, I dont know much regarding his activities during the early 90s, except that he was over 60 years old and allegedly controlled a loan sharking operation together with another possible and old EP member Joe Lombardi.

Spina was allegedly "hardcore" member who had two brothers and they came from the Near West Side and also knew Lombardo since "day one". The difference was that Spina was mainly involved in white collar crimes or corruption such as garbage collection, trucking operations, traffic signs etc. Who knows, maybe thats why both Lombardo and Centracchio saw the future in him.

As for the Chinatown crew, LaMantia was definitely under Monteleone who in turn reported to Jimmy LaPietra. Also, im not sure if LaMantia ever became official made guy, similar to D'Amico's situation.

Again, hope this helps.

LaMantias son Rocky (RIP) was crazy af. I was in his bar one time and a couple guys were annoying me.

Rocky literally came over and whispered in my ear if I wanted him to crack their heads open. I said that's unnecessary. He was really gonna do a number on em.

https://postimg.cc/ykDMWp2R

https://postimg.cc/xkN8RPkN

grand avenue crew circa 1992. should start a debate or 2, not an easy crew to figure out. even centracchio as capo is up for debate but consensus is that he was. with that being said the names of who succeeded joseph lombardo are many. first louis eboli in what would have been a brief tenure he died young in 1987. at same time both d;antonio and cozzo were mentioned as successors of either lombardo or eboli, yet centacchio was the only one ever indicted as leader of eboli-centracchio enterprise. this could be because of size and scope of lombardos crew. possible then eboli looked after gambling in chicago as capo, cozzo could have continued as connect to teamsters although later evidence shows no grand schemes mostly using power and influence to place cozzo family members in cushy well paying union jobs with health benefits. i think 2 of cozzos daughters ended up in local 786 as members. in this you can see the decreasing influence of outfit in union affairs from near national control to nepotism. d'antonio was contact for hanhardt crew until his 1993 death, i do not know who took over this role after possible koroluk?

lombardo was released nov 1992 so didnt see point of listing as i doubt he went back to anykind of criminal activity immediately.

more to come moving on to 1993-1994 timeline, a question first though?

i am thinking that andriacchi must have at this point been elevated into admin as acting or possibly permanent underboss, with monteleone as acting boss. seems like carlisi and difronzo agreed on monteleones elevation. my question is if andriacchis promotion was to underboss what role then did difronzo hold after 1993 conviction was overturned and he was released july 19 1994. did difronzo begin to remove himself from direct outfit affairs as early as 1994?

happy friday, CRANK SOME FRANK!!!

https://postimg.cc/dDLG7Tr6

https://postimg.cc/FYQSnWqC

here is another chart and some notes 1993-1994 era fellas...errrrrr TD.
enjoy the weekend everyone.

Looks good and thanks, although I personally would remove Messino and place Fratto instead because he was made back during the late 80s. Also, what about Dote from Grand? He was probably more powerful then Ciotti at the time...or maybe Spina? Or maybe you consider D'Amico as their leader or crew boss regarding certain operations (not capo)?



Another good one but again, what about the Dotes and Spina?

as usual TD i am putting together crew charts separate of admin ones. dote i have as leader or acting of d'amicos crew after the nov 1994 indictment and continuing even after dotes imprisonment through donald scalise on the street...1994-2000 +-.

next crew charts and admin will be for 1994-1997 timeline after difronzos release on appeal up to death of sam carlisi. i wont be posting any crew charts for 1993-1994 as there is not much change in members/associates compared to 1992 or 1994-1997.

perhaps i shouldnt have put any members under capos for 1993-1994. i do not put any importance on messino it was to show for certain members in outfit, which messino indeed was. however as you mentioned messino likely was not active.

i will plod on into the void.

Thats cool and feel free to send me pm if you need some different opinion. Maybe we can also make some better charts with pics and stuff...

TD for sure on adding pics and what not. for starters i dont have any pics for outfit guys at all full stop, this being the main reason why i present charts the way i have. and as i have stated numerous times my computer design skills are non existent. my intent with putting info out was indeed to have some kind of collaboration amongst other members of gbb.

so if we combine the admin and crew charts in a larger format to show associates/members including pics and stuff we should be well on the way to producing some really good accurate charts for once on the chicago outfit.

https://postimg.cc/yJ3YGtFb

nothing new same admin as posted couple days ago but without random members at bottom. will post like this from now on with crew charts separate.

Good to hear. Ill start collecting pics and also ill include another member of ours who knows his way around facebook and other social media.

an important question i think going forward with charts 1993 and on.
which crew do we place john matassa jr. ?

with the rush street crew no longer a crew after death of vincent solano in nov 1992, which crew did matassa move to if any?

did he move to...
melrose park
cicero
grand ave

i still have no idea to be honest.

After the end of the old North Side crew, all of their interests around the Northwest Side and remaining members/associates were mainly absorbed by the EP/Grand group, including Matassa jr. Regarding the specific crew he belonged to, Im not 100% sure since I think he went under EP but we have to re-check that info......

the fact matassa remained deeply involved in LIUNA affairs up to 1999 is important to note, seems to be his focus during 1992-1999 time period. i found in a IPSN report some info about a sit down over gambling machines between d'amico and matassa circa 1989/1990. it concerned who had authority over placement of machines in certain bars etc, the d'amico crew or matassa. i believe matassa won out and he was repping for joe culotta. i only mention because culottas name shows up later on in some charts as a capo!!! a claim i have never believed. if matassa was above culotta in 1989/1990 and was in grand ave crew, which seems possible, how then would culotta leap frog him by 2000s as some claim.

i also found some brief references to matassa having sitdowns with al tornabene and michael marcello circa 1994. likely again over gambling machines.
i can see matassa as being a member of grand ave, but perhaps a la anthony ortenzi from days past was direct with admin acting as an overall collector/messenger between different crews. this also may have led to the belief amongst some that matassa was consigliere or acting consigliere at some point late on...a belief i do not share.

well its saturday and i have another matassa theory.

with death in nov 1992 of vincent solano the rush street crew was dissolved.
sam carlisi was THE BOSS, #1 authority in outfit at this time and currently only under one indictment related to rincon casino case. with the dissolution of rush st i can see the territory once under their control going to grand ave. but carlisi/marcello had made inroads to that territory in the past when they took over the lenny patrick crew and brought them under their control, 1988/1989 i think.

so i think its possible that the territory was ceded to grand ave but as john matassa was a valuable member with the most contacts into LIUNA, involved in video gambling and street tax, carlisi could have decreed he was now in melrose park crew and there was seemingly nothing anyone could do or say about it. the other reason i think matassa went under carlisi, really under al tornabene is that after the carlisi/marcello dec 1992 indictment the melrose park crew had been decimated. going forward into next timelines, especially 1994-1997 the melrose park has basically no members under tornabene. evidence from family secrets has michael marcello and others starting to operate machines around 1996 or so. there has been chatter as well i think in comments on ANP or elsewhere that matassa began to drive james marcello around upon his 2003 release.

if this was the case, and is my belief now it was this would also allow for matassa being messenger or point of contact to other crews working direct with ruling admin and melrose park crew.

http://laborers_chicago.tripod.com/complaintnew.htm

lots of good LIUNA info in here, its about as dry as death valley and long but its in there. looks like matassa was meeting alot with monteleone, tornabene and michael marcello related to union affairs.

Vito check your private messages

https://www.justice.gov/usao-ndil/p...rged-pocketing-kickbacks-snowplow-vendor

wondering if any of the knowledgeable outfit posters on here have info on these 2.
i ask because of the last name, gironda and the fact its a scam at mccormick place.
i know there was a nicholas gironda, cousin to the caruso brothers that for a time had inherited bruno carusos position and influence at LIUNA local 1001.
i cannot find any info on dominic j. however, possible none of this is related to outfit ops but is worth a dig i think.