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Re: The Jewish Contribution to Organized Crime
[Re: Hollander]
#1107895
12/12/24 04:58 PM
12/12/24 04:58 PM
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Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 12,262
NYMafia
OP
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OP
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Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 12,262
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L.A./SAN FRANCISCO: Meyer (Mickey) Cohen Harold (Happy) Meltzer Irving G. Glasser Louis Glasser David Kessel ———
We can add probably a lot more for Los Angeles. Yes, Hollander, guaranteed for the money. Also, in places like Cleveland, Detroit, Chicago, etc. Like I mentioned, Although this list is relatively extensive, its but a scratch on the surface of all the Jewish hoodlums active over the years.
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Re: The Jewish Contribution to Organized Crime
[Re: Hollander]
#1107978
12/13/24 04:59 AM
12/13/24 04:59 AM
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Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 5,600 Underground
Toodoped
Murder Ink
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Murder Ink
![](/ubb/5stars.gif)
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 5,600
Underground
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L.A./SAN FRANCISCO: Meyer (Mickey) Cohen Harold (Happy) Meltzer Irving G. Glasser Louis Glasser David Kessel ———
We can add probably a lot more for Los Angeles. The Chicago Jewish list in this thread is a joke lol. There used to be at least 30 additional known Jewish gangsters and some on the list werent fully Jewish at all or didnt belong to Chicago lol lol For example, Hyman Levine, Harry and Sam Guzik, Louis Lipshultz, Dave and Sam Yaras, Lenny, Jack and Mike Patrick, Jens Larkin, Joe and Ben Epstein, the Caldwell bros, Bill Goldstein, Eddie Sturch, David Zatz, Ed Murphy, Joe Stein, Rosenthal, Leo and Sam Rugendorf, Aaron Oberlander, Rothman, Korshak, Jack Ruby etc. are missing from the list and most of those guys played major roles in the Outfit as crew leaders, hitmen or big moneymakers. Btw Heitler was half German and Sedway wasnt a Chicago guy lol Also, heres one old and quite interesting list regarding most of the Outfits non-Itals from the mid 1950s until mid 60s, made back in 2016... http://www.gangsterbb.net/threads/u...p;Board=8&main=35504&type=thread
Mongol General: Conan, what is best in life?
Conan: To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentations of their women.
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Re: The Jewish Contribution to Organized Crime
[Re: Toodoped]
#1107982
12/13/24 07:03 AM
12/13/24 07:03 AM
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Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 12,262
NYMafia
OP
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OP
![](/ubb/5stars10k.gif)
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 12,262
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Do your job like your like a professional researcher Liz and stop posting wrong info (try it sometime) lol I see you're looking to start your bullshit attacks again, huh? You're such a sad sack! Do everybody a favor and stay off my posts. Nobody on this forum wants to see your nasty comments.
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Re: The Jewish Contribution to Organized Crime
[Re: Toodoped]
#1107984
12/13/24 07:04 AM
12/13/24 07:04 AM
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Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 12,262
NYMafia
OP
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OP
![](/ubb/5stars10k.gif)
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 12,262
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L.A./SAN FRANCISCO: Meyer (Mickey) Cohen Harold (Happy) Meltzer Irving G. Glasser Louis Glasser David Kessel ———
We can add probably a lot more for Los Angeles. The Chicago Jewish list in this thread is a joke lol. There used to be at least 30 additional known Jewish gangsters and some on the list werent fully Jewish at all lol lol For example, Hyman Levine, Harry and Sam Guzik, Louis Lipshultz, Dave and Sam Yaras, Lenny, Jack and Mike Patrick, Jens Larkin, Joe and Ben Epstein, the Caldwell bros, Bill Goldstein, Eddie Sturch, David Zatz, Ed Murphy, Joe Stein, Rosenthal, Leo and Sam Rugendorf, Aaron Oberlander, Rothman, Korshak, Jack Ruby etc. are missing from the list and most of those guys played major roles in the Outfit as crew leaders, hitmen or big moneymakers. Btw Heitler was half German and Sedway wasnt a Chicago guy lol Also, heres one old and quite interesting list regarding most of the Outfits non-Itals from the mid 1950s until mid 60s, made back in 2016... http://www.gangsterbb.net/threads/u...p;Board=8&main=35504&type=threadThere is no need for your nasty and insulting comments. So cut it out.
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Re: The Jewish Contribution to Organized Crime
[Re: NYMafia]
#1107989
12/13/24 08:32 AM
12/13/24 08:32 AM
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Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 5,600 Underground
Toodoped
Murder Ink
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Murder Ink
![](/ubb/5stars.gif)
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 5,600
Underground
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I just gave you additional info and corrected some of your mistakes lol I feel sad for you Liz...a little bit lol obviously you need to learn to accept facts and you might get your site back if you stop lying to people for "few" miserable dollars You were already curbed for 'flaming' and starting trouble here. Are you looking for Turnbull to admonish you again? You're using your fantasy again because he never did that, while on the other hand with your multiple accounts and false info, you might be first on the hit list Liz (I can also see me referring to you as "Liz" doesnt trouble you, and almost the whole forum already knows this lol). Again, you're a sad case...and btw, I can post on every thread i want to since you made Chicago look like they had only few Jews in their organization, while they were THE most non-Italian family with Jewish guys on almost the same level as NY, and on top of that you made several mistakes. A liar such as yourself cannot stop me. Am I "destroying" your thread with facts and truthful info Liz??? Well from now on this is just the beginning, meaning Im going after every lie that you posted or will post here on this forum. Cheers
Mongol General: Conan, what is best in life?
Conan: To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentations of their women.
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Re: The Jewish Contribution to Organized Crime
[Re: Toodoped]
#1108004
12/13/24 11:18 AM
12/13/24 11:18 AM
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Joined: Mar 2021
Posts: 701
MafiaStudent
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Underboss
Joined: Mar 2021
Posts: 701
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I just gave you additional info and corrected some of your mistakes lol I feel sad for you Liz...a little bit lol obviously you need to learn to accept facts and you might get your site back if you stop lying to people for "few" miserable dollars You were already curbed for 'flaming' and starting trouble here. Are you looking for Turnbull to admonish you again? You're using your fantasy again because he never did that, while on the other hand with your multiple accounts and false info, you might be first on the hit list Liz (I can also see me referring to you as "Liz" doesnt trouble you, and almost the whole forum already knows this lol). Again, you're a sad case...and btw, I can post on every thread i want to since you made Chicago look like they had only few Jews in their organization, while they were THE most non-Italian family with Jewish guys on almost the same level as NY, and on top of that you made several mistakes. A liar such as yourself cannot stop me. Am I "destroying" your thread with facts and truthful info Liz??? Well from now on this is just the beginning, meaning Im going after every lie that you posted or will post here on this forum. Cheers Don't worry. The real Liz is here taking note of all your childish stupidity.
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Re: The Jewish Contribution to Organized Crime
[Re: MafiaStudent]
#1108049
12/13/24 03:12 PM
12/13/24 03:12 PM
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Joined: Nov 2023
Posts: 366
Havana
Capo
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Capo
Joined: Nov 2023
Posts: 366
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I just gave you additional info and corrected some of your mistakes lol I feel sad for you Liz...a little bit lol obviously you need to learn to accept facts and you might get your site back if you stop lying to people for "few" miserable dollars You were already curbed for 'flaming' and starting trouble here. Are you looking for Turnbull to admonish you again? You're using your fantasy again because he never did that, while on the other hand with your multiple accounts and false info, you might be first on the hit list Liz (I can also see me referring to you as "Liz" doesnt trouble you, and almost the whole forum already knows this lol). Again, you're a sad case...and btw, I can post on every thread i want to since you made Chicago look like they had only few Jews in their organization, while they were THE most non-Italian family with Jewish guys on almost the same level as NY, and on top of that you made several mistakes. A liar such as yourself cannot stop me. Am I "destroying" your thread with facts and truthful info Liz??? Well from now on this is just the beginning, meaning Im going after every lie that you posted or will post here on this forum. Cheers Don't worry. The real Liz is here taking note of all your childish stupidity. I noticed on your Upstate NY articles there were several names that sounded Jewish. For example on the DeStefano Crew list there is a guy named William Estoff as well as a Percy Schwartz,a Benjamin Slotnik,etc. How many Jews were active members of crews in the Upstate cities -Buffalo,Rochester,Syracuse,Binghamton,Utica,etc? Were any of them also some way connected to some of the NYC Families or Chicago families,particularly with big names Jewish members ,like Lansky or Rosenthal,etc
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Re: The Jewish Contribution to Organized Crime
[Re: NYMafia]
#1108055
12/13/24 03:59 PM
12/13/24 03:59 PM
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Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 12,262
NYMafia
OP
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OP
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Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 12,262
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Havana (quote):
I noticed on your Upstate NY articles there were several names that sounded Jewish. For example on the DeStefano Crew list there is a guy named William Estoff as well as a Percy Schwartz,a Benjamin Slotnik,etc. How many Jews were active members of crews in the Upstate cities -Buffalo,Rochester,Syracuse,Binghamton,Utica,etc? Were any of them also some way connected to some of the NYC Families or Chicago families,particularly with big names Jewish members ,like Lansky or Rosenthal,etc ---
Havana, to answer your question there are many guys on the NY list above who came from upstate NY.
But you're correct, aside from the ones I named in various upstate NY charts I researched, there were literally hundreds more sprinkled thought out The Empire State, pretty much anywhere there was an acknowledged mob or organized underworld. Here's a few more, including some you mentioned already:
Buffalo Jack (Sharkey) Ehrenreich Harry Hameroff Ralph Jacobs Julius Kramer Siney Lipsitz Walter Miller Greg Parness Solly Redcliff Harry (Al) Rosen Harry Segal Herbie Schaefer Herman Weinstein
Saratoga Ozzy Elderbaum Sam Gold Barney Olshein
Syracuse Sam Silver Morris Altman William (Willie) Estoff Jack Hazel Eli Rothman Benny Scornick
But believe me, the list goes on and on. At one time, they were major players.
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Re: The Jewish Contribution to Organized Crime
[Re: Havana]
#1108064
12/13/24 04:15 PM
12/13/24 04:15 PM
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Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 12,262
NYMafia
OP
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OP
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Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 12,262
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Is there any truth that European Jews were actually a mix of Jewish merchants, as well as Jews exiled by Romans from Israel who then married Italian women and who later during Inquisition migrated into Eastern Europe,Germany,etc ? That I can't speak to. But, regarding Jewish racketeers operating upstate, Utica's underworld also had their fair share of guys, many of whom interacted with, or were 'with' regime bosses Sal and Joe Falcone.
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Re: The Jewish Contribution to Organized Crime
[Re: NYMafia]
#1108065
12/13/24 04:16 PM
12/13/24 04:16 PM
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Joined: Nov 2023
Posts: 366
Havana
Capo
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Capo
Joined: Nov 2023
Posts: 366
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Havana (quote):
I noticed on your Upstate NY articles there were several names that sounded Jewish. For example on the DeStefano Crew list there is a guy named William Estoff as well as a Percy Schwartz,a Benjamin Slotnik,etc. How many Jews were active members of crews in the Upstate cities -Buffalo,Rochester,Syracuse,Binghamton,Utica,etc? Were any of them also some way connected to some of the NYC Families or Chicago families,particularly with big names Jewish members ,like Lansky or Rosenthal,etc ---
Havana, to answer your question there are many guys on the NY list above who came from upstate NY.
But you're correct, aside from the ones I named in various upstate NY charts I researched, there were literally hundreds more sprinkled thought out The Empire State, pretty much anywhere there was an acknowledged mob or organized underworld. Here's a few more, including some you mentioned already:
Buffalo Jack (Sharkey) Ehrenreich Harry Hameroff Ralph Jacobs Julius Kramer Siney Lipsitz Walter Miller Greg Parness Solly Redcliff Harry (Al) Rosen Harry Segal Herbie Schaefer Herman Weinstein
Saratoga Ozzy Elderbaum Sam Gold Barney Olshein
Syracuse Sam Silver Morris Altman William (Willie) Estoff Jack Hazel Eli Rothman Benny Scornick
But believe me, the list goes on and on. At one time, they were major players.
So why did they move Upstate from NYC? The same reason as the Mafia,Camorra,N'Drangheta? Because it was like unclaimed territory to exploit? Did the Jews ever practice their own version of black hand tactics before days of Prohibition? Was that guy Goldberg who killed the police in the 1950s a guy connected to any Jewish or Italian mob.TonyDanza played him in a movie?
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Re: The Jewish Contribution to Organized Crime
[Re: Havana]
#1108068
12/13/24 04:27 PM
12/13/24 04:27 PM
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Joined: Nov 2023
Posts: 366
Havana
Capo
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Capo
Joined: Nov 2023
Posts: 366
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Havana (quote):
I noticed on your Upstate NY articles there were several names that sounded Jewish. For example on the DeStefano Crew list there is a guy named William Estoff as well as a Percy Schwartz,a Benjamin Slotnik,etc. How many Jews were active members of crews in the Upstate cities -Buffalo,Rochester,Syracuse,Binghamton,Utica,etc? Were any of them also some way connected to some of the NYC Families or Chicago families,particularly with big names Jewish members ,like Lansky or Rosenthal,etc ---
Havana, to answer your question there are many guys on the NY list above who came from upstate NY.
But you're correct, aside from the ones I named in various upstate NY charts I researched, there were literally hundreds more sprinkled thought out The Empire State, pretty much anywhere there was an acknowledged mob or organized underworld. Here's a few more, including some you mentioned already:
Buffalo Jack (Sharkey) Ehrenreich Harry Hameroff Ralph Jacobs Julius Kramer Siney Lipsitz Walter Miller Greg Parness Solly Redcliff Harry (Al) Rosen Harry Segal Herbie Schaefer Herman Weinstein
Saratoga Ozzy Elderbaum Sam Gold Barney Olshein
Syracuse Sam Silver Morris Altman William (Willie) Estoff Jack Hazel Eli Rothman Benny Scornick
But believe me, the list goes on and on. At one time, they were major players.
So why did they move Upstate from NYC? The same reason as the Mafia,Camorra,N'Drangheta? Because it was like unclaimed territory to exploit? Did the Jews ever practice their own version of black hand tactics before days of Prohibition? Was that guy Goldberg who killed the police in the 1950s a guy connected to any Jewish or Italian mob.TonyDanza played him in a movie? I meant to say the cop killer was a guy named Jerry Rosenberg . Played in a 1980s movie with Tony Dana called "Doing Life". Rodsenberg originally got sentenced to the electric chair
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Re: The Jewish Contribution to Organized Crime
[Re: Havana]
#1108072
12/13/24 04:48 PM
12/13/24 04:48 PM
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Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 12,262
NYMafia
OP
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OP
![](/ubb/5stars10k.gif)
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 12,262
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Havana (quote):
I noticed on your Upstate NY articles there were several names that sounded Jewish. For example on the DeStefano Crew list there is a guy named William Estoff as well as a Percy Schwartz,a Benjamin Slotnik,etc. How many Jews were active members of crews in the Upstate cities -Buffalo,Rochester,Syracuse,Binghamton,Utica,etc? Were any of them also some way connected to some of the NYC Families or Chicago families,particularly with big names Jewish members ,like Lansky or Rosenthal,etc ---
Havana, to answer your question there are many guys on the NY list above who came from upstate NY.
But you're correct, aside from the ones I named in various upstate NY charts I researched, there were literally hundreds more sprinkled thought out The Empire State, pretty much anywhere there was an acknowledged mob or organized underworld. Here's a few more, including some you mentioned already:
Buffalo Jack (Sharkey) Ehrenreich Harry Hameroff Ralph Jacobs Julius Kramer Siney Lipsitz Walter Miller Greg Parness Solly Redcliff Harry (Al) Rosen Harry Segal Herbie Schaefer Herman Weinstein
Saratoga Ozzy Elderbaum Sam Gold Barney Olshein
Syracuse Sam Silver Morris Altman William (Willie) Estoff Jack Hazel Eli Rothman Benny Scornick
But believe me, the list goes on and on. At one time, they were major players.
So why did they move Upstate from NYC? The same reason as the Mafia,Camorra,N'Drangheta? Because it was like unclaimed territory to exploit? Did the Jews ever practice their own version of black hand tactics before days of Prohibition? Was that guy Goldberg who killed the police in the 1950s a guy connected to any Jewish or Italian mob.TonyDanza played him in a movie? For the same reasons all other ethnicities did. A better life through more access to jobs, wide open spaces, larger homes, and a more relaxed setting, as opposed to the teaming tenement buildings of the Lower East Side. Makes sense, no?
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Re: The Jewish Contribution to Organized Crime
[Re: NYMafia]
#1108076
12/13/24 04:59 PM
12/13/24 04:59 PM
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Joined: Nov 2023
Posts: 366
Havana
Capo
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Capo
Joined: Nov 2023
Posts: 366
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Havana (quote):
I noticed on your Upstate NY articles there were several names that sounded Jewish. For example on the DeStefano Crew list there is a guy named William Estoff as well as a Percy Schwartz,a Benjamin Slotnik,etc. How many Jews were active members of crews in the Upstate cities -Buffalo,Rochester,Syracuse,Binghamton,Utica,etc? Were any of them also some way connected to some of the NYC Families or Chicago families,particularly with big names Jewish members ,like Lansky or Rosenthal,etc ---
Havana, to answer your question there are many guys on the NY list above who came from upstate NY.
But you're correct, aside from the ones I named in various upstate NY charts I researched, there were literally hundreds more sprinkled thought out The Empire State, pretty much anywhere there was an acknowledged mob or organized underworld. Here's a few more, including some you mentioned already:
Buffalo Jack (Sharkey) Ehrenreich Harry Hameroff Ralph Jacobs Julius Kramer Siney Lipsitz Walter Miller Greg Parness Solly Redcliff Harry (Al) Rosen Harry Segal Herbie Schaefer Herman Weinstein
Saratoga Ozzy Elderbaum Sam Gold Barney Olshein
Syracuse Sam Silver Morris Altman William (Willie) Estoff Jack Hazel Eli Rothman Benny Scornick
But believe me, the list goes on and on. At one time, they were major players.
So why did they move Upstate from NYC? The same reason as the Mafia,Camorra,N'Drangheta? Because it was like unclaimed territory to exploit? Did the Jews ever practice their own version of black hand tactics before days of Prohibition? Was that guy Goldberg who killed the police in the 1950s a guy connected to any Jewish or Italian mob.TonyDanza played him in a movie? For the same reasons all other ethnicities did. A better life through more access to jobs, wide open spaces, larger homes, and a more relaxed setting, as opposed to the teaming tenement buildings of the Lower East Side. Makes sense, no? Makes sense for normal citizens .I was referring to Jewish and Italian gangsters who were plsanning to still be gangsters whren they moved Upstate. What made moving Upstate asttractive to gangsters,regardless of other opportunitiers for their kids,etc
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Re: The Jewish Contribution to Organized Crime
[Re: Havana]
#1108146
12/13/24 11:58 PM
12/13/24 11:58 PM
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Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 12,262
NYMafia
OP
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OP
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Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 12,262
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Thats probably what police and reporters theorized when these gangsters employing mafia,camorra ,black hand methods started showing up
Some early guys must have came to those boondock type towns compared to NYC sparked by some catalyst that made them make the move They must have sent back word to NYC/Brooklyn that there is money and power to be had and no competition for it Thats true. Not only in NY and NJ, but throughout the rest of the country too! How do you think so many Italiana -- and by proxy -- so many Italian gangsters ended up settling borgatas and crews in such far off destinations as San Jose, CA. and Rockford, IL? The gangsters, whether Italian, Jewish, Irish or what have you, followed the early migration patterns of those same ethnicities as they settled across America. Thats how we ended up with so many 'Families' spread out -- by following the 'American dream.'
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Re: The Jewish Contribution to Organized Crime
[Re: NYMafia]
#1108162
12/14/24 01:03 AM
12/14/24 01:03 AM
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Joined: Mar 2016
Posts: 29,240
Hollander
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![](/ubb/20k.gif)
Joined: Mar 2016
Posts: 29,240
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Jews have had a significant presence in European cities and countries since the fall of the Roman Empire, including Italy, Spain, Portugal, France, the Netherlands, Germany, Poland, and Russia. In Spain and Portugal in the late fifteenth century, the monarchies forced Jews to either convert to Christianity or leave and they established offices of the Inquisition to enforce Catholic orthodoxy of converted Jews. These actions shattered Jewish life in Iberia and saw mass migration of Sephardic Jews to escape religious persecution. Many resettled in the Netherlands and re-judaized, starting in the late sixteenth and early seventeenth centuries. In the religiously tolerant, Protestant Dutch Republic Amsterdam prospered economically and as a center of Jewish cultural life, the "Dutch Jerusalem". Ashkenazi Jews lived in communities under continuous rabbinic authority. In Europe Jewish communities were largely self-governing autonomous under Christian rulers, usually with restrictions on residence and economic activities.
"The king is dead, long live the king!"
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Re: The Jewish Contribution to Organized Crime
[Re: Hollander]
#1108177
12/14/24 08:51 AM
12/14/24 08:51 AM
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Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 12,262
NYMafia
OP
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OP
![](/ubb/5stars10k.gif)
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 12,262
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Jews have had a significant presence in European cities and countries since the fall of the Roman Empire, including Italy, Spain, Portugal, France, the Netherlands, Germany, Poland, and Russia. In Spain and Portugal in the late fifteenth century, the monarchies forced Jews to either convert to Christianity or leave and they established offices of the Inquisition to enforce Catholic orthodoxy of converted Jews. These actions shattered Jewish life in Iberia and saw mass migration of Sephardic Jews to escape religious persecution. Many resettled in the Netherlands and re-judaized, starting in the late sixteenth and early seventeenth centuries. In the religiously tolerant, Protestant Dutch Republic Amsterdam prospered economically and as a center of Jewish cultural life, the "Dutch Jerusalem". Ashkenazi Jews lived in communities under continuous rabbinic authority. In Europe Jewish communities were largely self-governing autonomous under Christian rulers, usually with restrictions on residence and economic activities. Interesting history.
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