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The Bloody Cleveland vs. Pittsburgh Turf War! #1117240
03/15/25 08:02 AM
03/15/25 08:02 AM
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 12,599
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NYMafia Offline OP
NYMafia  Offline OP

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Joined: Sep 2019
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Last edited by NYMafia; 03/19/25 06:22 AM.
Re: The Bloody Cleveland vs. Pittsburgh Turf War! [Re: NYMafia] #1117597
03/19/25 06:25 AM
03/19/25 06:25 AM
Joined: Sep 2019
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NYMafia Offline OP
NYMafia  Offline OP

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Joined: Sep 2019
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A seemingly never ending Cosa Nostra battle for supremacy between the Scalish and LaRocca Families.

Re: The Bloody Cleveland vs. Pittsburgh Turf War! [Re: NYMafia] #1117607
03/19/25 02:37 PM
03/19/25 02:37 PM
Joined: Mar 2020
Posts: 606
Paris
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Malavita Offline
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Malavita  Offline
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Paris
Probably the only real war between two Families. Wouldn't you say ?

There has been conflicts between families which sometimes ended up in made guys being killed but we have never seen a full out war like this one.

Re: The Bloody Cleveland vs. Pittsburgh Turf War! [Re: Malavita] #1117614
03/19/25 04:42 PM
03/19/25 04:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Malavita
Probably the only real war between two Families. Wouldn't you say ?

There has been conflicts between families which sometimes ended up in made guys being killed but we have never seen a full out war like this one.



You know what, Malavita, thats an extremely perceptive overview you presented. Bravo!

I never viewed it that way. But I think you are correct. Very much so, in fact.

With the exception of the legendary Castellammarese War that was fought not only between families, but nationwide, with many borgatas weighing in with manpower, resources and influence, the "Cleveland vs. Pittsburgh" conflict was the only one that comes to mind that was fought between rival Families, per se.

All the others, regardless how bloody and high-profiled they may have been, were fought between rival "factions" within the same Family.

Re: The Bloody Cleveland vs. Pittsburgh Turf War! [Re: NYMafia] #1117819
03/21/25 06:21 PM
03/21/25 06:21 PM
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NYMafia Offline OP
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This conflict...competition...continued on and off for decades. It was truly one for the record books.

Re: The Bloody Cleveland vs. Pittsburgh Turf War! [Re: NYMafia] #1118123
03/24/25 04:15 PM
03/24/25 04:15 PM
Joined: Sep 2019
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Next, ButtonGuys swings over to Brooklyn as the blood spills.

Re: The Bloody Cleveland vs. Pittsburgh Turf War! [Re: NYMafia] #1118124
03/24/25 04:23 PM
03/24/25 04:23 PM
Joined: Apr 2015
Posts: 594
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majicrat Offline
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majicrat  Offline
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Underboss
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didn't the Bonanno's and the Outfit have it out over Las Vegas?

Re: The Bloody Cleveland vs. Pittsburgh Turf War! [Re: NYMafia] #1118127
03/24/25 04:57 PM
03/24/25 04:57 PM
Joined: Jan 2020
Posts: 1,092
Woodlawn
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VitoCahill Offline
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VitoCahill  Offline
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Woodlawn
only in bill roemers alternate reality

Re: The Bloody Cleveland vs. Pittsburgh Turf War! [Re: NYMafia] #1118193
03/25/25 05:09 PM
03/25/25 05:09 PM
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NYMafia Offline OP
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LOL. So true!

Re: The Bloody Cleveland vs. Pittsburgh Turf War! [Re: NYMafia] #1118276
03/26/25 12:45 PM
03/26/25 12:45 PM
Joined: Apr 2015
Posts: 594
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majicrat Offline
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majicrat  Offline
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I don't know anything about his book, but educate me on why you say it's his alternate reality? I was thinking of getting it.

Re: The Bloody Cleveland vs. Pittsburgh Turf War! [Re: NYMafia] #1118282
03/26/25 02:49 PM
03/26/25 02:49 PM
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Posts: 1,092
Woodlawn
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VitoCahill Offline
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Woodlawn
it has been a long time since i read the book so forgive me if memory is hazy. but i believe roemers book depicts a mostly fictitious 'war' between the outfit and the bonanno family in the time period after anthony spilotros murder. it puts blame on outfit for taking out spilotro no surprise in that but it gives impression that post 1986 the vegas rackets were then up for grabs and that the bonanno family made a push to take them over. more specific though is that it was joe bonannos west coast crew specifically who made a grab at them. i dont think this scenario ever took place re outfit vs. bonanno family in a straight up war similar to that described by ny mafia above regarding cleveland and pittsburgh crime families.

there was definitely an outfit presence in las vegas after murder of spilotro bros in 1986. their must have been money still on street from loan sharking that needed to be collected and other rackets which jives with some indictments that came later in late 80s and early 90s. but again i have never seen anything conclusive about a war. further to that if any war did happen we hear nothing about it when ; joe massino begins to cooperate a guy who was near the top in bonannos around this time. or sal vitale for that matter or any of the other high level made men in the bonannos that cooperated that may have had knowledge of said conflict between 2 families.

so then who did joe bonanno still have with any power and influence around him to make a putsch against of all families the outfit in the 80s and the answer is no one because nothing ever happened.

Re: The Bloody Cleveland vs. Pittsburgh Turf War! [Re: NYMafia] #1118283
03/26/25 02:53 PM
03/26/25 02:53 PM
Joined: Jan 2020
Posts: 1,092
Woodlawn
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VitoCahill Offline
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VitoCahill  Offline
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Underboss
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Woodlawn
i would say finally if you enjoy organized crime/mafia fiction books and care not for accuracy...read on. i would not spend much on this book so if you see it at a used bookstore and is cheap go for it. i remember the appendix and addendums having some good info about who roemer thought was in charge in early 1990/1991 in outfit and the 1983 chart is in there as well (same from accardo book, spilotro book).

Re: The Bloody Cleveland vs. Pittsburgh Turf War! [Re: NYMafia] #1118363
03/27/25 07:50 AM
03/27/25 07:50 AM
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majicrat Offline
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majicrat  Offline
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Ok great ty

Re: The Bloody Cleveland vs. Pittsburgh Turf War! [Re: NYMafia] #1118467
03/28/25 04:10 AM
03/28/25 04:10 AM
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 12,599
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NYMafia Offline OP
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Now, this was a war!

(a legit one)


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