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Re: Iranian President Questions Holocaust
#138488
12/08/05 04:47 PM
12/08/05 04:47 PM
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Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 31,300 New Jersey, USA
J Geoff
The Don
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The Don
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 31,300
New Jersey, USA
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Here's the full article: Iran president expresses doubt holocaust happened By Paul Hughes Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad on Thursday expressed doubt the Holocaust took place and suggested the Jewish state of Israel be moved to Europe. His comments, reported by Iran's official IRNA news agency from a news conference he gave in the Saudi Arabian city of Mecca, follow his call in October for Israel to be "wiped off the map," which sparked widespread international outrage. The latest comments also provoked quick condemnation. German Chancellor Angela Merkel called them "totally unacceptable" and British Foreign Secretary Jack Straw said "I condemn them unreservedly. They have no place in civilized political debate." Ahmadinejad was quoted by IRNA as saying: "Some European countries insist on saying that Hitler killed millions of innocent Jews in furnaces and they insist on it to the extent that if anyone proves something contrary to that they condemn that person and throw them in jail." "Although we don't accept this claim, if we suppose it is true, our question for the Europeans is: is the killing of innocent Jewish people by Hitler the reason for their support to the occupiers of Jerusalem?" he said. "If the Europeans are honest they should give some of their provinces in Europe -- like in Germany, Austria or other countries -- to the Zionists and the Zionists can establish their state in Europe. You offer part of Europe and we will support it." The Nazis killed some 6 million Jews during their 1933-1945 rule. Ahmadinejad's remarks drew swift rebukes from Israel and Washington. ISRAEL, WASHINGTON RESPOND Raanan Gissin, a spokesman for Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon, said in Tel Aviv Ahmadinejad was voicing "the consensus that exists in many circles in the Arab world that the Jewish people ... do not have the right to establish a Jewish, democratic state in their ancestral homeland." "Just to remind Mr. Ahmadinejad, we've been here long before his ancestors were here," Gissin said. "Therefore, we have a birthright to be here in the land of our forefathers and to live here. Thank God we have the capability to deter and to prevent such a statement from becoming a reality." Deputy U.S. State Department spokesman Adam Ereli called the remarks "appalling and reprehensible." "They certainly don't inspire hope among any of us in the international community that the government in Iran is prepared to engage as a responsible member of the community," he said. A news conference with French President Jacques Chirac near Berlin, Merkel also said: "With our historical responsibility in mind, I can only say that we reject them (Ahmadinejad's comments) in the harshest possible terms. "We will do everything to make it clear that Israel's right to existence is in no way endangered. I am firmly convinced that a majority in the international community has a similar opinion on this issue," she said. Chirac said he agreed completely. Religious hardliners in Iran do not publicly deny the Holocaust occurred but say its scale has been exaggerated to justify the creation of Israel and continued Western support for it. Close allies when Iran was ruled by the U.S.-backed Shah, Iran and Israel have become implacable foes since Iran's 1979 Islamic revolution. Israel accuses Iran of giving arms and funding to militant Palestinian groups such as Islamic Jihad and of building nuclear weapons. Iran denies the charges. Tehran calls Israel a "terrorist state" and has developed missiles which can reach it. It says it would use them if Israel, itself believed to be nuclear armed, tried to bomb Iranian nuclear facilities. (Additional reporting by Jeffrey Heller in Jerusalem)
I studied Italian for 2 semesters. Not once was a "C" pronounced as a "G", and never was a trailing "I" ignored! And I'm from Jersey! lol Whaddaya want me to do? Whack a guy? Off a guy? Whack off a guy? --Peter Griffin My DVDs | Facebook | Godfather Filming Locations
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Re: Iranian President Questions Holocaust
#138491
12/08/05 05:18 PM
12/08/05 05:18 PM
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Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 113
Flame Angel
Made Member
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Made Member
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 113
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and while were on the topic of the holocaust being fake :rolleyes: im amazed at all of the men, women, and children that they were able to convince to starve themselves to the point of having - 5% body fat just to take pictures to fool the world into believing
"pretty in punk..." setting off metal detectors in a town near you
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Re: Iranian President Questions Holocaust
#138492
12/08/05 05:19 PM
12/08/05 05:19 PM
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Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 2,907 Born on the Bayou
Saladbar
Underboss
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Underboss
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 2,907
Born on the Bayou
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There are photos, maps, building plans, invoices, memos from the Nazi command, census information, Nazi officials' memoirs, and various other categories of data which all support the assertion that the Nazis actually intended to exterminate undesirables by the millions.
To say it didn't exist only implies part fanatical anti-semitism, and part, um, well I better not say.
"Patriotism is supporting your country all the time and your government when it deserves it"
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Re: Iranian President Questions Holocaust
#138496
12/08/05 05:48 PM
12/08/05 05:48 PM
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Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 15,058 The Slippery Slope
plawrence
RIP StatMan
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RIP StatMan
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 15,058
The Slippery Slope
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Holocaust denial isn't limited to the lunatic fringe. Errol Morris, the documentary film director who made the critically acclaimed The Thin Blue Line about an innocent man who spent about 15 years on death row in Texas before being freed, also did a documentry, MR. DEATH (1999), about Fred Leuchter. Leuchter an American designer, builder, and repairman of electric chairs, gas chambers, and gallows, had a sterling reputation for his work and was hired by several different states to improve their means for legal executions. In 1998 he visited Germany, studied the remains of the German concentration camps and concluded, based on the forensic evidence he was able to obtain at the various sites, that it was impossible for the holocaust to have taken place.
"Difficult....not impossible"
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Re: Iranian President Questions Holocaust
#138497
12/08/05 06:29 PM
12/08/05 06:29 PM
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 485
Mad Johnny
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Posts: 485
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Umm... devil's advocate again...
People are missing the point. Iran knows the Holocaust happened. Their point is the Holocaust does not justify the creation of Israel. I've said this before- Israel was founded by Jewish terrorists who were supported by Western powers, mainly the US. The US gave Israel WWII surplus to fight its way into existence.
Let's be honest here, the only reason Israel exists is because of US intervention. This is the truth, not anti-Semitism. The fact is Israel did not actually fight their own war and win. European Jews flooded Palestine and through acts of violence and foreign corruption created a state out of foreigners.
Devils advocate… I’ll at least do that much to keep the conversation from becoming one sided.
Officially the victim/target of the first and third Non-Aggression Pact attacks #2 is Fathersson # 4 is Double-J
Proud Member of the Gangster BB Bratpack - Fighting Elitism and Ignorance Since 2006
Double-J: may you serve us better from above, smile on from heaven
"Buh-Bye"
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Re: Iranian President Questions Holocaust
#138498
12/08/05 06:52 PM
12/08/05 06:52 PM
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Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 2,907 Born on the Bayou
Saladbar
Underboss
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Underboss
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 2,907
Born on the Bayou
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Originally posted by Mad Johnny: European Jews flooded Palestine and through acts of violence and foreign corruption created a state out of foreigners.
Devils advocate… I’ll at least do that much to keep the conversation from becoming one sided. Fair enough. Have you given up your home to a native-american indian yet? Well, it is one thing to think Jewish people exploit the holocaust for their own benefit, another to influence and distort history to the point you deny facts. The holocaust involved more than just jewish people, but also homosexual, gyspy, and other victims- all deemed unfit for german society. Ever read or heard of the Balfour Declaration? The drive for a homeland was in place a long time before the Holocaust. The Jewish assumption of a homeland began long before WWII, and by the start of the war, the Jewish population of Palestine was over 30%. The Holocaust, and the persecution that it revealed increased the migration, and we know what happened subsequently. But guess what? It's the Israelis that I blame. Not Jews. Israelis. It's a world of difference.
"Patriotism is supporting your country all the time and your government when it deserves it"
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Re: Iranian President Questions Holocaust
#138500
12/08/05 08:16 PM
12/08/05 08:16 PM
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 12,155 Some anonymous motel room.
Don Vercetti
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 12,155
Some anonymous motel room.
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Hitler was underrated. He kissed babies, improved health care, and was a man of the people. 6 million Jews? Come on! Where did this come from? Those photos you see of the starved Jews are just photos of Paris Hilton, Nicole Ritchie, and the Olsen twins. :rolleyes:
Sarcasm aside, I think anyone who denies this happened is a dunce.
Mad Johnny, my knowledge on this subject is VERY limited and probably fallible, but didn't the Palestinians allow the Jews their land, and only wanted to kick them out when their financial intellect made them more successful than expected? I can't remember where I learned this so correct me if I'm wrong, which I probably am.
Proud Member of the Gangster BB Bratpack - Fighting Elitism and Ignorance Since 2006
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Re: Iranian President Questions Holocaust
#138501
12/08/05 08:31 PM
12/08/05 08:31 PM
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 485
Mad Johnny
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BANNED
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Posts: 485
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Mad Johnny, my knowledge on this subject is VERY limited and probably fallible, but didn't the Palestinians allow the Jews their land, and only wanted to kick them out when their financial intellect made them more successful than expected? I can't remember where I learned this so correct me if I'm wrong, which I probably am. Umm, bold is mine... Yeah, that's pretty typical anti-semetism
Officially the victim/target of the first and third Non-Aggression Pact attacks #2 is Fathersson # 4 is Double-J
Proud Member of the Gangster BB Bratpack - Fighting Elitism and Ignorance Since 2006
Double-J: may you serve us better from above, smile on from heaven
"Buh-Bye"
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Re: Iranian President Questions Holocaust
#138504
12/08/05 10:30 PM
12/08/05 10:30 PM
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 485
Mad Johnny
BANNED
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BANNED
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 485
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He was elected because he won the vote.
Officially the victim/target of the first and third Non-Aggression Pact attacks #2 is Fathersson # 4 is Double-J
Proud Member of the Gangster BB Bratpack - Fighting Elitism and Ignorance Since 2006
Double-J: may you serve us better from above, smile on from heaven
"Buh-Bye"
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Re: Iranian President Questions Holocaust
#138506
12/09/05 09:57 AM
12/09/05 09:57 AM
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Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 15,058 The Slippery Slope
plawrence
RIP StatMan
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RIP StatMan
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 15,058
The Slippery Slope
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Originally posted by Enzo Scifo: Can someone refresh my memory: Is it in the USA a crime saying the holocaust didn't exist? No. Read my post above about the Errol Morris documentary. Originally posted by Don Vercetti: How is that anti-Semitic? If anything it's a good thing. From what I remember hearing the majority had more savvy financial intellect and management, which is supposedly one of the reasons they persevered through the years without being crushed by a rival It could be considered anti-Semitic because it feeds and reinforces a sterotype, true or not. Like saying Blacks make better athletes, or Irish people drink more.
"Difficult....not impossible"
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Re: Iranian President Questions Holocaust
#138508
12/09/05 10:07 AM
12/09/05 10:07 AM
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 2,854 Milky Way
Enzo Scifo
Underboss
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Underboss
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 2,854
Milky Way
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Originally posted by plawrence: because it feeds and reinforces a sterotype, true or not. Like saying Blacks make better athletes Well, actually there's kind of a truth in it. It has something to do with fysionomy. Africans are often better athletes, but not in all sports. An example: in long-distance running (10 kilometers, marathon), North/West Africans excel. It's because of how the behind of there ankle is build, that part of their body is more evolved than other people's. This has something to do with Evolution, but since many people don't believe in Evolution, my post makes no sense.
See, we can act as smart as we want, but at the end of the day, we still follow a guy who fucks himself with kebab skewers.
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Re: Iranian President Questions Holocaust
#138509
12/09/05 10:09 AM
12/09/05 10:09 AM
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 770 UK
The Dr. who fixed Lucy
Underboss
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Underboss
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 770
UK
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Don Vercetti didn't the Palestinians allow the Jews their land Yeah, that's what they did! Changing the subject slightly, it's one thing to deny the holocaust entirely... but what about those who dispute its scale? What about if an historian says that 5.5 million and not 6 million Jews were killed? What about if he says 3 million? At what point is someone a "dunce"? I only ask because in some counties (Germany) it's a criminal offence to deny the holocaust. Of Mahmoud Ahmadinejad's comments: Iran is an Islamic state and supports the Palestinian cause,. and the deep-seated hatred of the Israli state and Jews generally. If a European leader doubted the holocaust he would rightly be castigated, but coming from the President of Iran, it seems entirely uncontroversial. Wrong, of course, but not shocking considering its source.
Joey ...
BANG BANG
... Saza!
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Re: Iranian President Questions Holocaust
#138512
12/09/05 12:37 PM
12/09/05 12:37 PM
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 12,155 Some anonymous motel room.
Don Vercetti
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 12,155
Some anonymous motel room.
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Originally posted by The Dr. who fixed Lucy: [quote]Don Vercetti [b]didn't the Palestinians allow the Jews their land Yeah, that's what they did! [/b][/quote]Instead of laughing on something I said I was probably mistaken in how about telling me what happened?
Proud Member of the Gangster BB Bratpack - Fighting Elitism and Ignorance Since 2006
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Re: Iranian President Questions Holocaust
#138513
12/09/05 12:41 PM
12/09/05 12:41 PM
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 770 UK
The Dr. who fixed Lucy
Underboss
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Underboss
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 770
UK
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I'm sorry, but does it sound very likely that the Palestinians would have agreed to give up their homeland? Here's a link http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel/History#Early_history_of_modern_Israel And the relevant part: Following World War II, the British announced their intention to withdraw from the mandate of Palestine. The United Nations General Assembly (GA Resolution 181, November 29, 1947) proposed the partition of Palestine into two states, an Arab state and a Jewish state, with Jerusalem to be under United Nations administration (see map). Most Jews in Palestine accepted the proposal, while most of the Arabs in Palestine rejected it. The Arabs totally rejected the idea of a Jewish state in Palestine In the age of Wikipedia there is no excuse for ignorance. Sorry!
Joey ...
BANG BANG
... Saza!
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