I really wish Plaw would have finished his GF novel. His novel was 100x's better. The few chapters he wrote was so much more interesting than this garbage and I'm only in ch.4.

Winegardner please do us a big favor and write something you know about.

Is there a link to this story? You've sparked my interest!

Here you go :


http://www.gangsterbb.net/threads/ubbthr...=true#Post30252



Don Cardi

SPOILERS *** UP TO CHAPTER 21 - BOOK 4 *** SPOILERS


Let me tell you, it's been a struggle to get through what has really turned into a very boring story.

For instance Winegardner spends almost half a chapter describing Jack Woltz's newly renovated house. Now I understand the underlying message that Winegardner is trying to get across with that description in regards to what once happened to Woltz (horses head and breach of security), but there was absolutely no need to spend a half a chapter on that description when it could have been done in about a half a page.

And this Francesca Corleone screwing Johnny Fontaine sub story is just ridiculous, so far meaningless, and a waste of time. There was so much that Winegardner could have done with the Francesca character.

Also a lot of menaingless diolague between Connie and Francesca.

Michael basically is just a guest star in this book.

Mr. Winegardner, I will never understand how Puzo and his family picked you to carry on the Godfather tradition. You have absolutely no imagination whatsoever. There are times I wonder if you really ever read the Godfather, or even watched the movies.

Sad. What could have been a great continuing saga has been turned into junk.



Don Cardi

Preach on brother
As much as I love to read I am having trouble reading this pig slop. I've had this book since it came out and I am only on pg.56 I can see it now this book will take 6 months to read just like Returns did. That is sad also.

Have you ever considered a speed reading course?



I'll do you one better. I've looked in on the inside front cover only. You've got 56 pages on me!

I am glad I didnt buy it. Plaw's sequels were better.

I'm new here, so I'll start off with a very short observation.
Why does Winegardner keep using the term "whack" , when I don't recall anybody, let alone a "civilian" reporter, using that term in the 60's ? Frankly, before the surveillance tapes of the 80's, I defy you to find that term used anywhere outside of "the life". Just a pet peeve of mine. As far as the book itself, it's actually painful to read. I only endured it out blind loyalty to the original characters.

I guess we're neck-in-neck!

Hey Geoffy,

Did you ever finish GF Returns?

Err uhh...

Workin' on it! I take it to the laundromat with me... trouble is, I don't go often enough! lol

for those who have read both novels, or have read enough of both...tell me which one is the better novel? and second, should i even bother buying either of them? i held of on gf returns because of its bad reviews...but i read the first chapter once when i was in a bookstore and found it to be a bit interesting.

Quality-wise, they're about the same.

You can probably pick up "Returns" in the discount stacks for a few bucks, so it might be worth it.

"Revenge" assumes you know what happened in "Returns," so if you want to read either, read "Returns" first.

If you are really a hardcore Godfather freak, both books will piss you off because the canonical characters, mainly Michael Corleone, are such minor players in the plot, while page after page and chapter after chapter are spent on concocted characters like Nick Gerace, who we really don't care much about.

question - how come author said sonny was 37 years old when he died...i thought he was 32 1916 - 1948

Sonny was born in 1910 (according to the novel).

Winegardner didn't even get important dates right?

He wouldn't know his ass from a hole in the ground

In all fairness to Winegardner, he took ALL his trivial info from Puzo's book (and not the movies).

SC,
Have you got past the inside front cover yet?

As he should have. After all the books are continuations, well are supposed to be continuations, based on the original novel.

He still sucks as a writer. Boring shit. So much potential thrown down the drain.

Geoff, I want his e-mail address. I want to ask him some questions. The one question that I really want to ask him is "What the F**K were you thinking when you wrote these books?"

This one should have been titled : WINEGARDNER'S REVENGE


Don Cardi

DC,

Ask him why is so much of the books about Nick Geraci?

I think that Winegardner has an axe to grind with Michael.
He's very quick to point out what he perceives as Michael's shortcomings as a Don, while singing Geraci's praises.
He knows that he couldn't eliminate the Corleones completely so he gave them a backseat to the Geraci character.

you can contact him on his website, his email is there, i already did contact him

and as for sonny's age i was going by the timeline and my book

THE CORLEONE TIMELINE Last updated - 27 Nov 04

*1911 - Las Vegas officially becomes a city
1914 - Vito & Carmella get married
1916 - Santino (Sonny) & Tom Hagen born
1917 - Vito's Little Italy sequence begins (De Niro)
*1917 - Sicilian (Mafia) Don Morello murdered by Neapolitan (Camorra) Don Morano
*1918-1922 - Merger of Mafia and Camorra. Giuseppe Masseria is boss.
*1919 - Prohibition begins
1919 - Vito (27) kills Fanucci; Fredo born, gets pneumonia

What do I tell him? "Winegardner, you suck as a writer?"

Anyways I am sure that he reads these boards. There are even hints in his writing about some of the GF character traits that I would swear he picked up from reading these boards.

Then there are times when he portrays certain GF characters in certain ways that I find hard to believe. Especially some of the things that he has Michael say or do.

Truthfully, do you really think that Johnny Fonatane would have sex with Santino Corleone's daughter, the neice of the most powerful mobster in America? And even that aside, I find it very hard to believe that Johhny Fontane would disrespect his Godfather's memory by doing something like that.

I do have to admit though, I've grown to like his Nick Gerace character.



Don Cardi

Well, I don't think Winegardner sucks as a writer, in fact I don't hate either book as much as a lot of people here apparently do, and yes Nick Gerace does come to command your attention to some extent, but I do think that both books ultimately fail because they neglect the major characters in the saga.

Plus, although Tom Hagen is a fairly major character in "Revenge," the story completely misses the boat in exploring potential conflicts or rifts in the loyalty between Hagen and Michael Corleone -- which was quite clearly the primary theme being set up for Part III by subtle plot points written into the later scenes of Part II.

Had Puzo and FFC been able, or willing, to make GF III in the late 1970s or early 1980s, as originally intended, OR had they been able to re-sign Duvall for the cast when they finally DID make it, the growing tension and possible conflict between Hagen and Michael Corleone would almost certainly have been one of the central plotlines.

In fact, in my opinion, most of the character of Don Altobello (longtime trusted family friend of the Corleones, almost a part of the family himself, former close confidante of Vito, with many other contacts in the world of organized crime, who ends up shockingly betraying Michael) was probably adapted off of ideas they were going to use with Tom Hagen, had Duvall been signed for the film.

I'm a bit new here so I'm not sure if you guys are aware that the original script for GF 3, from May of 89, is viewable online.
If you check it out you'll see that Tom was supposed to have a tremendous part.
In this early draft it seems to me that Puzo/FFC had Hagen loyal to Michael to the very end.
Anyway, you can see it at joblo.com/movie scripts
Just click on The Godfather 3 link.

JoBlo comes up, but doesn't show scripts and says that PAGE IS MISSING.




Don Cardi

Went and read it; very interesting.

As I suspected, the Vincent/Mary romance was a much smaller part of the storyline.

Enzo, could you please post a link? I'd love to read it.



Don Cardi

Here ya go; it's a very long .pdf file, so it may take a while to load.

GF III script - 1989

The only link to GF3 in their scripts section sends you to JG's GF3
transcript.