0 registered members (),
481
guests, and 56
spiders. |
Key:
Admin,
Global Mod,
Mod
|
|
Forums21
Topics43,350
Posts1,086,319
Members10,381
|
Most Online1,254 Mar 13th, 2025
|
|
|
Re: Bob Dylan
[Re: long_lost_corleone]
#396086
05/26/07 08:49 PM
05/26/07 08:49 PM
|
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 5,316 east coast
Anthony Lombardi
|

Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 5,316
east coast
|
by no means was i reflecting on your words, i was speaking in generalities. i agree that a listener & a musician both get different senses of pleasure & purpose from a jam; however, that can be said for music as a whole. music is what you make of it, & what holds meaning to you could either hold an entirely different meaning, or even be completely meaningless, to someone else. also, what meaning it holds to the musician can hold an entirely different purpose & profundity to the listener, according to their own experiences & perspective.
i should point out & reiterate though, that i am a musician - i just don't play with the same frequency that i used to. like i said, i find the art of self-ordainment & restraint to be much more effective than jamming, but that's just my perspective - as we all have our own.
the power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those who have not got it. george bernard shaw
|
|
|
Re: Bob Dylan
[Re: Anthony Lombardi]
#396094
05/26/07 10:11 PM
05/26/07 10:11 PM
|
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 4,512 Right here, but I'd rather be ...
long_lost_corleone
Underboss
|
Underboss
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 4,512
Right here, but I'd rather be ...
|
Well, I love both restraint and jamming. I hate to keep making an example of Floyd, but there was a time where I had wished they'd jam here and there live. Then came a point where I realized it'd have a complete different impact and disrupt the atmosphere of the music and show. With other bands, I feel that jamming is beautiful, and restraint would destroy them. Take RHCP. I think John Frusciante and Flea have excellent chemistry as the two string/melodic instrumentalists of the groups, and the four-way connection of the band is even more impressive. If they didn't utilize that connection by almost telepathically going into jams and improvisations at their live shows, I think it'd be a waste of a gifted relationship.
Then you have post-rock, as I've mentioned. Post-rock songs, Dependant on band, seem to range from 6-30 minutes, and yet I think they still have a restraint. Jamming would ruin that restraint, and cutting the songs down to four minutes would also ruin that restraint, if you can make sense of that... It's a rather minimalistic genre, I think the restraint comes from not fighting to do too much, but still managing to make an impressive wall of sound with conventional rock instruments like guitar, bass, drums, and occasionally keys, and then still working in complimentary instrumental cells like string quartets, brass bands, electronic sampling and experimentation, and so on.
"Somebody told me when the bomb hits, everybody in a two mile radius will be instantly sublimated, but if you lay face down on the ground for some time, avoiding the residual ripples of heat, you might survive, permanently fucked up and twisted like you're always underwater refracted. But if you do go gas, there's nothing you can do if the air that was once you is mingled and mashed with the kicked up molecules of the enemy's former body. Big-kid-tested, motherf--ker approved."
|
|
|
Re: Bob Dylan
[Re: DonVitoCorleone]
#396133
05/27/07 04:29 AM
05/27/07 04:29 AM
|
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 5,316 east coast
Anthony Lombardi
|

Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 5,316
east coast
|
a month or so ago, i actually made myself a mixtape compiling my favorite dylan songs. i normally don't make single artist mixes unless i'm making an intro mix for a member of the uninitiated (since i'll invariably choose to listen to the original albums over a self-assembled playlist), but i was talking with a friend of mine about our favorite dylan albums/songs, & it came up that i tend to have a "type" of dylan song that i gravitate towards. with this in mind, i compiled a mixtape of my favorite dylan songs to see if there was indeed a unifying theme or atmosphere permeating throughout. this was the final product (it's in chronological order by date & time recorded):
"with your eyes like smoke & your prayers like rhymes"
1.) "don't think twice, it's all right" 2.) "one too many mornings" 3.) "to ramona" 4.) "mama, you been on my mind" 5.) "i'll keep it with mine" 6.) "love minus zero/no limit" 7.) "it's alright, ma (i'm only bleeding)" 8.) "mr. tambourine man" 9.) "just like tom thumb's blues" 10.) "4th time around" 11.) "visions of johanna" 12.) "sad-eyed lady of the lowlands" 13.) "tonight i'll be staying here with you" 14.) "you're a big girl now" 15.) "if you see her, say hello" 16.) "buckets of rain"
i encourage any of you to attempt such a task; due to the stunningly high quality of dylan's early 60's through mid 70's work, it's incredibly difficult to trim it down to a mere 80-90 minutes. it took me quite a while & cost me alot of frustration. if any of you decide to try it, make sure to post the playlist here, i'd love to see how our tastes differ.
my top 5 favorite dylan songs are as follows:
1.) "mama, you been on my mind" 2.) "don't think twice, it's all right" 3.) "love minus zero/no limit" 4.) "i'll keep it with mine" 5.) "if you see her, say hello"
the power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those who have not got it. george bernard shaw
|
|
|
Re: Bob Dylan
[Re: Anthony Lombardi]
#396155
05/27/07 11:59 AM
05/27/07 11:59 AM
|
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 4,512 Right here, but I'd rather be ...
long_lost_corleone
Underboss
|
Underboss
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 4,512
Right here, but I'd rather be ...
|
totally agree with the RHCP example - john frusciante & flea have great chemistry, excellent use of restraint & powerful grooves. sometimes they tend to indulge a bit much for my tastes, but it's never less than interesting & always tasteful.
not much of a fan of post-rock, it's completely & totally boring to me actually. i've always been a lyric man, anyhow. There are times I tend to dulge in lyrics, and others when I'm just over taken by the force of the music itself... I enjoy classical music a bit, so post-rock is sort of a common ground between rock and symphonic. And I just find Sigur Rós' music to be some of the most beautiful to grace my ears. But... uh... Yeah... Dylan. I think I mostly prefer the abstract period, as Mick put it. Highway 61, Blonde on Blonde... There's just too much to list or get into.
"Somebody told me when the bomb hits, everybody in a two mile radius will be instantly sublimated, but if you lay face down on the ground for some time, avoiding the residual ripples of heat, you might survive, permanently fucked up and twisted like you're always underwater refracted. But if you do go gas, there's nothing you can do if the air that was once you is mingled and mashed with the kicked up molecules of the enemy's former body. Big-kid-tested, motherf--ker approved."
|
|
|
Re: Bob Dylan
[Re: Capo de La Cosa Nostra]
#396199
05/27/07 04:53 PM
05/27/07 04:53 PM
|
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 5,316 east coast
Anthony Lombardi
|

Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 5,316
east coast
|
If CDs weren't limited to 80 minutes, and if it weren't so damn fucking long, "Highlands" would definitely be on any Dylan compilation I made.
I was actually planning a thread over on FCM which would ask members to consider one 80-minute-long CD, and choose their ultimate favourite Dylan songs to fill it. "highlands" would definitely be on volume two or three if i decided to go that far. the part where the waitress asks him to draw a portrait of her is an absolute riot. i suggest you attempt a dylan mix yourself; it's even harder than it sounds. come on, don't be a wuss. 
the power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those who have not got it. george bernard shaw
|
|
|
Re: Bob Dylan
[Re: Anthony Lombardi]
#401462
06/13/07 08:19 AM
06/13/07 08:19 AM
|
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 12,543 Gateshead, UK
Capo de La Cosa Nostra
|

Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 12,543
Gateshead, UK
|
Sorry, I meant to return to this. can you name me one artist that had their stylistic range (from folk to country to blues to rockabilly to soul to r&b to music hall to psychedelic rock to hard rock, the list goes on & on & on) in such a short period of time, accomplished with such a dazzling array of success (including vast amounts of critical favor & praise nearly a half century later, peerless enduring popularity, record-breaking album sales & unmatched influence)? i doubt you could name a single musician. Well, versatility alone doesn't amount to greatness, of course, and I'm not sure whose opinion you're going by on "success", your own, or "The Majority". "Vast amounts of critical favour" again doesn't bring inherent greatness. (But it might.) Shakespeare's still studied today, but he's not necessarily good. (I think he is, but that's because I like his work.) Everybody loves Gone With the Wind, but I gave it a prompt "no stars" when I saw it last; also, I recognise and acknowledge influence, but consider it separately to measuring greatness. But we've been down this path before. How, by the way, would you define the following phrases: "unmatched influence" "peerless enduring popularity" "dazzling array of success" They sound like fashionable (and dismissable) buzz-phrases, to me. Anyway, to answer your question, here's a few names that come to mind, for versatility, artistic innovation, enduring appeal and ultimately, influence. DJ Shadow, Aphex Twin, Radiohead, Tom Waits, Lee "Scratch" Perry, Damon Albarn. Oh wait, and Dylan.  (Should Dylan be dismissed because The Beatles sold more records than him?)  And, for what it's worth, since we're all sounding very snobbish already, I'll say that Eminem's Marshal Mathers LP is worth ten Sgt. Peppers as far as lyricism goes.
Last edited by Capo de La Cosa Nostra; 06/13/07 08:22 AM.
...dot com bold typeface rhetoric. You go clickety click and get your head split. 'The hell you look like on a message board Discussing whether or not the Brother is hardcore?
|
|
|
Re: Bob Dylan
[Re: Capo de La Cosa Nostra]
#401508
06/13/07 12:17 PM
06/13/07 12:17 PM
|
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 18,238 The Ravenite Social Club
Don Cardi
Caporegime
|
Caporegime

Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 18,238
The Ravenite Social Club
|
My favorite Dylan song :
JOEY
Born in Red Hook, Brooklyn, in the year of who knows when Opened up his eyes to the tune of an accordion Always on the outside of whatever side there was When they asked him why it had to be that way, "Well," he answered, "just because."
Larry was the oldest, Joey was next to last. They called Joe "Crazy," the baby they called "Kid Blast." Some say they lived off gambling and runnin' numbers too. It always seemed they got caught between the mob and the men in blue.
Joey, Joey, King of the streets, child of clay. Joey, Joey, What made them want to come and blow you away?
There was talk they killed their rivals, but the truth was far from that No one ever knew for sure where they were really at. When they tried to strangle Larry, Joey almost-a-hit the roof. He went out that night to seek revenge, thinkin' he was bulletproof.
The war broke out at the break of dawn, it emptied out the streets Joey and his brothers suffered terrible defeats 'Til they ventured out behind the lines and took five prisoners. They stashed them away in a basement, called them amateurs.
The hostages were tremblin' when they heard a man exclaim, "Let's blow this place to kingdom come, let Con Edison take the blame." But Joey stepped up, an' he raised his hand, said, "We are not those kind of men. It's peace and quiet that we need to go back to work again."
Joey, Joey, King of the streets, child of clay. Joey, Joey, What made them want to come and blow you away?
The police department hounded him, they called him Mr. Smith They got him on conspiracy, they were never sure who with. "What time is it?" said the judge to Joey when they met "Five to ten," said Joey. Judge says, "That's exactly what you get."
He did ten years in Attica, reading Nietzsche and Wilhelm Reich They threw him in the hole one time for tryin' to stop a strike. His closest friends were black men 'cause they seemed to understand What it's like to be in society with a shackle on your hand.
They let him out in '71 he'd lost a little weight But he dressed like Jimmy Cagney and I swear he did look great. He tried to find the way back in , to the life he left behind To the boss he said, "I have returned and now I want what's mine."
Joey, Joey, King of the streets, child of clay. Joey, Joey, What made them want to come and blow you away?
It was true that in his later years he would not carry a gun "I'm around too many children," he'd say, "they should never know of one." Yet he walked right into the clubhouse of his lifelong deadly foe, Emptied out the register, said, "Tell 'em it was Crazy Joe."
One day they blew him down in a clam bar in New York He could see it comin' through the door as he lifted up his fork. He pushed the table over to protect his family Then he staggered out into the streets of Little Italy.
Joey, Joey, King of the streets, child of clay. Joey, Joey, What made them want to come and blow you away?
Sister Jacqueline and Carmela and mother Mary all did weep. I heard his best friend Frankie say, "He ain't dead, he's just asleep." Then I saw the old man's limousine head back towards the grave I guess he had to say one last goodbye to the son that he could not save.
The sun turned cold over President Street and the town of Brooklyn mourned They said a mass in the old church near the house where he was born. And someday if God's in heaven overlookin' His preserve I know the men that shot him down will get what they deserve.
Joey, Joey, King of the streets, child of clay. Joey, Joey, What made them want to come and blow you away?
Don Cardi Five - ten years from now, they're gonna wish there was American Cosa Nostra. Five - ten years from now, they're gonna miss John Gotti.
|
|
|
Re: Bob Dylan
[Re: Don Cardi]
#401509
06/13/07 12:27 PM
06/13/07 12:27 PM
|
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 12,543 Gateshead, UK
Capo de La Cosa Nostra
|

Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 12,543
Gateshead, UK
|
DC, that whole album is seeped in melancholic injustice. Desire is my favourite Dylan album. His voice is most appealing on it, too (he's accompanied by Joan Baez, of course).
It should be noted that he co-wrote the album with Jacques Levy, but that takes nothing away from its achievement.
"Isis" would be on any favourites compilation, for me, and "Sara" is one of the few songs during which I have to walk out of the room if others are present, since I feel an inner, jealous rage that I should share it with anyone else.
...dot com bold typeface rhetoric. You go clickety click and get your head split. 'The hell you look like on a message board Discussing whether or not the Brother is hardcore?
|
|
|
Re: Bob Dylan
[Re: Don Vercetti]
#401682
06/14/07 12:23 AM
06/14/07 12:23 AM
|
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 22,902 New York
SC
Consigliere
|
Consigliere

Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 22,902
New York
|
I'll be seeing Bob Dylan in about two weeks. Lucky you!! plawrence had tix for Dylan last year (about this time of year) and was trying to give them away (realizing he was too sick to attend) and he couldn't get any takers! 
.
|
|
|
Re: Bob Dylan
[Re: Saladbar]
#402293
06/14/07 08:53 PM
06/14/07 08:53 PM
|
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 8,766 South of the Pinelands
MaryCas
|

Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 8,766
South of the Pinelands
|
He's not the greatest songwriter in history though.
John Lennon, Leonard Cohen, Neil Young, Richard Thompson, and Captain Beefheart are all better.
I'd say it's much harder to write lyrics that appeal to millions and work musically and thematically than it is to write ambiguous imagery that's mostly meaningless overwrought metaphors.
Some of Dylan's lyrics are really stupid, but some make so much sense. It's like he throws a million words at you and lots of it is senseless shit, but there are some real gems hidden in the pile.
The man wrote a lot of damn words. oh dear God what anti-American blasphemy!! Dylan was a genius!! Yeah, but you gotta admit that Captain Beefheart....man he could cook.....lyrics, I think - what was his biggest hit again, I forget. 
Whoever exalts himself will be humbled, whoever humbles himself will be exalted - Matthew 23:12
|
|
|
Re: Bob Dylan
[Re: Don Andrew]
#408021
06/28/07 10:33 PM
06/28/07 10:33 PM
|
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 4,512 Right here, but I'd rather be ...
long_lost_corleone
Underboss
|
Underboss
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 4,512
Right here, but I'd rather be ...
|
I thought it sounded like drunken Christmas blues.
"Somebody told me when the bomb hits, everybody in a two mile radius will be instantly sublimated, but if you lay face down on the ground for some time, avoiding the residual ripples of heat, you might survive, permanently fucked up and twisted like you're always underwater refracted. But if you do go gas, there's nothing you can do if the air that was once you is mingled and mashed with the kicked up molecules of the enemy's former body. Big-kid-tested, motherf--ker approved."
|
|
|
|