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Re: CAMPAIGN 2008
[Re: Just Lou]
#515226
10/13/08 01:27 PM
10/13/08 01:27 PM
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 13,145 East Tennessee
ronnierocketAGO
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 13,145
East Tennessee
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Since Romney is supposed to be an "economic genius", McCain would probably be ahead right now. Or at the worst, in much better position. If he would have picked Lieberman, he would have lost all support from the conservative base. His support from them is still shaky as it is. It would have probably locked up Florida for him, but cost him in many other states. With Lieberman, he would have bet that the conservatives would have supported McCain, because they sure as hell aint gonna vote for Obama. As for Romney, I don't know if he would have helped them. I mean yeah some Conservatives think of him as their savior, despite being a Morman Pro-Choice Governor, but he has another problem that hurt him in the primaries... He's an ASSHOLE, or at best DOUCHEBAG.
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Re: CAMPAIGN 2008
[Re: ronnierocketAGO]
#515262
10/13/08 04:56 PM
10/13/08 04:56 PM
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Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 8,389 Staten Island / New Jersey
Just Lou
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Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 8,389
Staten Island / New Jersey
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The news is nothing but bad for McCain right now:
National CNN Obama 50, McCain 42 Obama +8
National Reuters/CSpan/Zogby Obama 48, McCain 44 Obama +4
National Hotline/FD Tracking Obama 48, McCain 42 Obama +6
National Gallup Tracking Obama 52, McCain 43.5 Obama +8.5
National ABC News/Wash Post Obama 53, McCain 43 Obama +10
National Democracy Corps (D) Obama 51, McCain 42 Obama +9
National Rasmussen Tracking Obama 50, McCain 45 Obama +5
National GW/Battleground Obama 51, McCain 43 Obama +8
National Newsweek Obama 52, McCain 41 Obama +11
Colorado PPP (D) Obama 52, McCain 42 Obama +10
Florida Rasmussen Obama 50, McCain 47 Obama +3
Florida Research 2000 Obama 49, McCain 44 Obama +5
Florida Strategic Vision (R) Obama 52, McCain 44 Obama +8
Iowa SurveyUSA Obama 54, McCain 41 Obama +13
Michigan Rasmussen Obama 56, McCain 40 Obama +16
Missouri SurveyUSA Obama 51, McCain 43 Obama +8
Nevada LVRJ/Mason-Dixon Obama 47, McCain 45 Obama +2
North Carolina Rasmussen Obama 49, McCain 48 Obama +1
North Dakota Forum Poll/MSUM Obama 45, Mccain 43 Obama +2
Ohio Marist Obama 49, McCain 45 Obama +4
Ohio Strategic Vision (R) Obama 48, McCain 46 Obama +2
Pennsylvania Morning Call Tracking Obama 51, McCain 38 Obama +13
Pennsylvania Marist Obama 53, McCain 41 Obama +12
Virginia PPP (D) Obama 51, McCain 43 Obama +8
Wisconsin Research 2000 Obama 51, McCain 41 Obama +10
..And some new ones released this evening:
Ohio FOX News/Rasmussen Obama 49, McCain 47 Obama +2
Florida FOX News/Rasmussen Obama 51, McCain 46 Obama +5
North Carolina FOX News/Rasmussen Obama 48, McCain 48 Tie
Virginia FOX News/Rasmussen Obama 50, McCain 47 Obama +3
Missouri FOX News/Rasmussen Obama 50, McCain 47 Obama +3
Last edited by Just Lou; 10/13/08 05:40 PM.
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Re: CAMPAIGN 2008
[Re: olivant]
#515299
10/13/08 07:59 PM
10/13/08 07:59 PM
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Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 25,984 California
The Italian Stallionette
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Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 25,984
California
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I gotta say things are looking really good for Obama. It's hard not to get over confident. In politics, 3 weeks can change everything. Still, I have a very good feeling. I'm just skimming some stories this evening, but Obama gaining in swing states, his favorability rating is high and Christopher Hitchens is supporting Obama??? I heard McCain say he was gonna kick O's "you know what" at the debate Wednesday. Hmmmmm. Which reminds me, did you all see that skit (I think from one of the late night shows) mimicking the last debate, showing McCain wandering around the stage aimlessly asking if anyone's seen his dog. TIS
"Mankind must put an end to war before war puts an end to mankind. War will exist until that distant day when the conscientious objector enjoys the same reputation and prestige that the warrior does today." JFK
"War is over, if you want it" - John Lennon
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Re: CAMPAIGN 2008
[Re: The Italian Stallionette]
#515304
10/13/08 08:57 PM
10/13/08 08:57 PM
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 13,145 East Tennessee
ronnierocketAGO
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 13,145
East Tennessee
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I gotta say things are looking really good for Obama. It's hard not to get over confident. In politics, 3 weeks can change everything. Still, I have a very good feeling. I'm just skimming some stories this evening, but Obama gaining in swing states, his favorability rating is high and Christopher Hitchens is supporting Obama??? He is: http://www.slate.com/id/2202163/An exerpt of his case: "On "the issues" in these closing weeks, there really isn't a very sharp or highly noticeable distinction to be made between the two nominees, and their "debates" have been cramped and boring affairs as a result. But the difference in character and temperament has become plainer by the day, and there is no decent way of avoiding the fact. Last week's so-called town-hall event showed Sen. John McCain to be someone suffering from an increasingly obvious and embarrassing deficit, both cognitive and physical. And the only public events that have so far featured his absurd choice of running mate have shown her to be a deceiving and unscrupulous woman utterly unversed in any of the needful political discourses but easily trained to utter preposterous lies and to appeal to the basest element of her audience."I heard McCain say he was gonna kick O's "you know what" at the debate Wednesday. Hmmmmm. Before the second debate, he promised that "the gloves would be off." How did that work for ya John? Which reminds me, did you all see that skit (I think from one of the late night shows) mimicking the last debate, showing McCain wandering around the stage aimlessly asking if anyone's seen his dog. TIS I did, and it was funny.
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Re: CAMPAIGN 2008
[Re: ronnierocketAGO]
#515305
10/13/08 08:58 PM
10/13/08 08:58 PM
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 13,145 East Tennessee
ronnierocketAGO
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 13,145
East Tennessee
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"Part of reassurance is intellectual. Like Palin, he's a rookie, but in his 19 months on the national stage he has achieved fluency in areas in which he has no experience. In the foreign policy debate with McCain, as in his July news conference with French President Nicolas Sarkozy, Obama held his own -- fluid, familiar and therefore plausibly presidential.
Oliver Wendell Holmes Jr. famously said of Franklin Roosevelt that he had a "second-class intellect, but a first-class temperament." Obama has shown that he is a man of limited experience, questionable convictions, deeply troubling associations (Jeremiah Wright, William Ayers, Tony Rezko) and an alarming lack of self-definition -- do you really know who he is and what he believes? Nonetheless, he's got both a first-class intellect and a first-class temperament. That will likely be enough to make him president."-- Charles Krauthammer (Conservative FOX NEWS Analyst)http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...d=opinionsbox1
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Re: CAMPAIGN 2008
[Re: Just Lou]
#515308
10/13/08 09:25 PM
10/13/08 09:25 PM
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Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 25,984 California
The Italian Stallionette
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Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 25,984
California
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JL, I'll ask you this cause I know you do the sports thread but anyone else feel free to answer. It would be fun to do some "NON" money betting game in regards to the election. Something that everyone can join in on without it mattering who you are voting for. For instance, whoever comes closest to the total electoral votes for each candidate, or popular votes (don't think I can count that high) ? Or who will win the swing states Something that we could all contribute or something on-going. Since this election IS historic, it might be fun. Yes? No? Bad idea? I'm just not good at composing these things. TIS
"Mankind must put an end to war before war puts an end to mankind. War will exist until that distant day when the conscientious objector enjoys the same reputation and prestige that the warrior does today." JFK
"War is over, if you want it" - John Lennon
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Re: CAMPAIGN 2008
[Re: The Italian Stallionette]
#515311
10/13/08 09:42 PM
10/13/08 09:42 PM
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Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 8,389 Staten Island / New Jersey
Just Lou
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Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 8,389
Staten Island / New Jersey
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JL, I'll ask you this cause I know you do the sports thread but anyone else feel free to answer. It would be fun to do some "NON" money betting game in regards to the election. Something that everyone can join in on without it mattering who you are voting for. For instance, whoever comes closest to the total electoral votes for each candidate, or popular votes (don't think I can count that high) ? Or who will win the swing states Something that we could all contribute or something on-going. Since this election IS historic, it might be fun. Yes? No? Bad idea? I'm just not good at composing these things. TIS I'll play. We can just post our predictions here, and see what happens. My prediction is: Obama: 349 51% McCain: 189 45%
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Re: CAMPAIGN 2008
[Re: ronnierocketAGO]
#515350
10/14/08 12:17 AM
10/14/08 12:17 AM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,528 In a van down by the river!
Longneck
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,528
In a van down by the river!
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RICHMOND, Va. - Republican vice presidential candidate Sarah Palin mistook some of her own fans for hecklers Monday at a rally that drew thousands.
A massive crowd of at least 20,000 spread across the parking lot of Richmond International Raceway, and scores of people on the outer periphery more than 100 yards from the stage could not hear.
"Louder! Louder!" they began chanting, and the cry spread across the crowd to Palin's left. Some pointed skyward, urging that the volume be increased.
Palin stopped her remarks briefly and looked toward the commotion.
"I hope those protesters have the courage and honor to give veterans thanks for their right to protest," she said.
Some in the crowd tried to shout toward her what was really being said, but she couldn't hear them.
On a sunny day in which many had stood in place for more than three hours without shade, at least 25 people collapsed from heat-related illnesses and three were hospitalized, according to the Henrico County fire department.
Palin had campaigned with John McCain earlier Monday in Virginia Beach, only the second time the GOP ticket has campaigned in Virginia since June. Democrat Barack Obama or his running mate, Joe Biden, together visited the state eight times during that span.
Virginia has been solidly Republican for 40 years but is now a battleground, with both sides locked in a very close race for the state's 13 electoral votes.
Addressing the crowd, Palin largely avoided her recent criticisms of Obama. Instead, she acknowledged the emotion that has built up on both sides, particularly since the financial collapse.
"There is a lot of anger. There is anger at the inside dealing and anger at lobbyists and anger at the greed on Wall Street. There is anger at the Washington elite and there is anger at voter fraud," she said.
She promised a spending freeze if she and McCain win, and evoked cheers of "Drill, Baby, Drill!" in calling for greater domestic mining and oil drilling. The crowd roared when she criticized Biden for remarks he made in Ohio that the United States had little interest in coal-fired electrical power.
The afternoon's loudest ovation came when country music star Hank Williams Jr. offered a rendition of his hit "Family Tradition" that opened by assailing "the left-wing liberal media."
Palin later appeared in northern Virginia, raising half a million dollars at a fundraiser in McLean. About 400 people attended the $1,500 per person event Monday evening at the Ritz Carlton in Tysons Corner. The money goes to the Republican Party since the McCain campaign can't raise any more money under federal rules.
Palin said voters will not be fooled into thinking that McCain's election would be the equivalent of a third term for President Bush. She said McCain "took the gloves off" at his campaign appearances Monday and shouldn't be faulted for pointing out differences in the two tickets' records.
About 40 Democratic protesters waved signs at rush-hour commuters in busy Tysons Corner before the event.
Long as I remember The rain been coming down. Clouds of Mystery pouring Confusion on the ground. Good men through the ages, Trying to find the sun; And I wonder, Still I wonder, Who'll stop the rain.
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Re: CAMPAIGN 2008
[Re: Just Lou]
#515361
10/14/08 04:07 AM
10/14/08 04:07 AM
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Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 5,325 MI
Lilo
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Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 5,325
MI
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http://darkush.blogspot.com/2008/10/making-history.htmlMaking History? Steven Barnes
Will someone with more of a sense of political history than I possess please falsify the following statement, if possible: "the GOP has given us the first-ever Presidential/Vice Presidential slate with one member adjudicated guilty of a severe ethics violation and the other formally accused of a severe ethics/law violation. "
With the crowds at McCain's rallies yelling for blood, when he (thankfully) finally admonished them to be sane, saying that they had nothing to fear from Obama, he was BOOED by his own people. Shows the ugliness that he and Palin had been stoking...but I have to give him credit for backing away from the edge of THAT abyss. There is something uglier here than Clinton's stoking of her followers, and how she seemed to realize in the final days that she may have pushed things to the point that it would be difficult for the Democrats to pull together to beat the Republicans.
In the same way, I think that cooler heads are whispering to McCain that he is raising the possibility of actual violence, and, if he loses, that the Republican base might be so angry and frightened that the country would be difficult to govern. A Pyrrhic victory is bad enough. But a Pyrrhic DEFEAT would be flat insane. And McCain isn't nuts. Brittle and angry, yeah. I think he's experiencing a bit of what the Clinton's felt: "how in the hell is this happening?" If ANYONE here had grasped how smart Obama is, they might have laid better plans. I really, seriously, think they underestimated him, thinking that somehow Affirmative Action had raised this naive, inexperienced but charismatic guy to the national level. They were playing checkers, he's playing chess. ᅠ
I repeat my original impression: not that this would make him a great President, but Obama is the smartest person I've seen on the national stage running for national office. Watched his latest move? A British paper says that he's offered McCain a job in his new administration.
What? I see this as multi-pronged, and I don't think there is a direct riposte:
1) It is supremely confident, at a time Americans need desperately to believe in their leaders as BOTH capable and confident.
2) It suggests he's ready to reach "across the aisle". Supposedly, the post would be a bi-partisan post on Veterans Affairs.
3) IF McCain DOESN'T reciprocate in some way, independant voters may think that he is ingracious. If he DOES, then it undercuts his argument that Obama can't be trusted. ᅠ
Note the way he dared McCain to call him a terrorist sympathizer to his face? In all likelihood, McCain hasn't been looking him in the eye as an attempt to keep his temper under control. (Ah...if this is true, is there anyone out there who thinks this is a valid strategy for a chief executive or a diplomat..?) So he is tempting McCain into a trap. First, Obama has far more emotional control. Second, he has an answer up his sleeve that will be HARSH, designed to both rebut and trigger an outburst. Watching McCain wandering around the stage...I regretfully conclude that he is on the borderline of losing some control factors. I would say that his best days are not in front of him, and it is sad to watch.
Palin? I cannot begin to imagine her on "Meet The Press" or any kind of remotely antagonistic forum. McCain, Obama, and Biden would survive such grilling without a sweat. Does anyone out there think she would have been chosen if she weren't pretty? I think McCain thought she'd give America a chubby.
What a fascinating, fascinating election this has been. And it ain't over yet.
Best case? McCain tones down the rhetoric, sharpens his message, and runs a campaign more in alignment with his stated values. He either wins, or loses, with honor.
Worst case? I don't even want to go there. But I have never heard more violent rhetoric in a Presidential campaign. Maybe I just haven't been paying attention?
For those of you who heard Fox News referring to "Obama's Baby Mama" and speculating about assassination, and heard the crowds spouting venom while Palin and McCain stoked the fires...if you weren't repelled, if you didn't automatically demand more from your candidate or network of choice...what would you say to yourself if an actual violent incident occurred. "Oh well?" "I didn't realize..?" "Thank goodness!"
I would bet that the proportion of the population that considers this acceptable political discourse overlaps remarkably with that percentage that has negative views of black people to begin with.
I have a theory that I'm calling the "Obama Effect" that suggests that there is a threshold beyond which his race could actually work in his favor. It goes like this: IF it is pretty clear he's going to win anyway, I suspect that there are many, many Americans who are waffling on the borderline, and that in the voting booth, if they think Obama's going to win anyway...they may decide to vote FOR him simply for the sake of being on the right side of history. They will want to be able to say they voted for him. This might actually give him a boost over polling at the last minute, a sort of "reverse Bradley effect" created by 300 years of pressure. I can see how it might happen...once.
But it's like that guy with the refrigerator on his back in the roller skating contest: IF you can get to the top of the hill, the trip down is a little faster. But making it up the hill is a b****, and it's quite amusing to see those unencumbered ones complaining that "refrigerator guy has an unfair advantage..."
It's a particular and, to me, palely amusing form of blindness.
Notice how quickly the Republicans screamed that scrutiny of Palin was sexism? That tactic, screaming sexism, racism, ageism, whatever, is one of the first things any group does to oppress criticism. Blacks have done it plenty. Hell, Republicans claim "Liberal Bias" in the media even when their candidates are stomping butt. So the game is played across the board, but it doesn't remove the fact that there is very real sexism, racism, etc. out there. How we negotiate this ground in the 21st century will be one of our greatest tasks. How do we sort out the real complaints from the purely political posturing?
"When the snows fall and the white winds blow, the lone wolf dies but the pack survives." Winter is Coming
Now this is the Law of the Jungle—as old and as true as the sky; And the wolf that shall keep it may prosper, but the wolf that shall break it must die. As the creeper that girdles the tree-trunk, the Law runneth forward and back; For the strength of the Pack is the Wolf, and the strength of the Wolf is the Pack.
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Re: CAMPAIGN 2008
[Re: dontomasso]
#515415
10/14/08 11:18 AM
10/14/08 11:18 AM
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Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 31,310 New Jersey, USA
J Geoff
The Don
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The Don
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 31,310
New Jersey, USA
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You forgot this referring to Hank Jr.: Not close to his father's accomplishments and talent.
I studied Italian for 2 semesters. Not once was a "C" pronounced as a "G", and never was a trailing "I" ignored! And I'm from Jersey! lol Whaddaya want me to do? Whack a guy? Off a guy? Whack off a guy? --Peter Griffin My DVDs | Facebook | Godfather Filming Locations
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