That's amazing.

Yeah, the huge surplus that was left over from the Clinton years which was created by
the dot-com boom that arose during the 90's.


A dot-com boom which created a false surplus in both the economy, NASDQ and the dow jones industrial average. A financial "paper tiger."

A huge surplus during 90's that was created by "cooked books" from what was artificially pumped into the economy from what later turned out to be falsly profitable companies like ENRON.

Oh, and let's not forget another one from the Clinton era named Worldcom.

This all took place under the Clinton administration watch.


While I am not defending President Bush here when it comes to the economic practices that we've seen in this country over the last several years, please, let's not paint such a rosey and colorful picture that implies that President Clinton and his years in office produced such a real influx of economical value for us Americans. Try painting that rosey picture to all of those hard working people who lost not only their jobs, but their pensions and everything else that they worked so hard for while working for those dot-coms, Enrons and Worldcoms.

The financial and economical benefits of the 90's, during the Clinton years, only appeared to be so wonderful. The mid to late 90's appeared to be so wonderful financially because the dot-com boom appeared to be making billions and billions of $$$ along with the Enron and Worldcom type companies. The dot-coms turned out to be bullshit while at the same time the Enrons and the Worldcoms were cooking their books. And this all took place during the Clinton years, under his watch, and wound up collapsing as we started a new millinium. The dot-com dominated NASDAQ market spiraled downward in what turned out to be close to something like a $3 trillion loss. Workers saw their money dissappear and found out that they had worked all of those years only to wind up without either a pension or a health plan!

A false "surplus" that was "left over from the Clinton years" for the next administration to 'inherit" and clean up!

Just admit it...you miss Bubba as President.

Oh, puh-leeze, DC. How can you take those eight words from my entire post out of context and comment on them? Why didn't you bother to respond to the rest of the post which spoke to the horror that the past eight years has been, and the completely and totally incompetent manner in which the Bush administration handled everything? Instead, you took eight words and spun quite the little fantasy about them.

Plenty of people made fortunes on those dot coms. And how would Enron impact the federal budget?

Perhaps you can explain to me how the federal budget had a "fake" surplus. It was either there, or it wasn't. And according to this chart from www.factcheck.org, it was definitely there.

I despise Clinton personally, but he was a god-send to fiscal conservatives.

I've noticed that SNL has made fun of everybody in the campaign except for Obama. I wonder why they won't go after him?

They Haven't came up with a way to make fun of him yet, they said it in the paper

Also, he's boring. Not Al Gore ridiculously dull boring, but Obama has just not been successfully defined by comics, outside of "just another politician."

"I know what his campaign slogan in 2012 will be, "Don't Change!"" - Jay Leno

Looks like most people, including myself, are wrong:


Staten Island teens' night of hatred targeted others, prosecutors say.

It was pure hatred that prompted two 18-year-olds from Staten Island's East Shore to allegedly jump in their car and cruise to Stapleton to seek out an African American, any African American, to pummel bloody, on the night Barack Obama became the country's president elect.

Those were the charges leveled by the District Attorney's office at Ralph Nicoletti of Wadsworth Avenue, Fort Wadsworth, and Bryan Garaventa of the 100 block of Maryland Avenue in Rosebank -- both 18 -- during their arraignment this morning at Stapleton Criminal Court. (Click here for a photo gallery.)

The defendants, looking pale and exhausted, were both charged with assault in the second degree as a hate crime and criminal possession of a weapon, in connection with the election night incident, in which they are accused of jumping out of their slow-moving vehicle on Vanderbelt Avenue, and setting upon 17-year-old Ali Kamara, beating the teen bloody with a pipe and an asp baton, while yelling "Obama."

"This is a despicable crime," said Assistant District Attorney Mario Mattei, as the defendants stood wearing jeans in front of Judge Desmond Green. "They were out to target black people."

About a dozen of the suspects' family members looked on from the back of the court room.

As the young defendants' mothers stood by their sides -- Nicoletti's mother bald from treatments from what his attorney called a terminal illness -- the judge set bail at $10,000 cash or $25,000 collateral. The two are set to return to court Thursday.

Two additional suspects are also being sought according to police. The men, according to court papers, got riled up for their night by saying "let's get some n----" and beat Kamara with a pipe and an asp baton, calling the weapon a "n---- beater."

The victim needed staples to close the lacerations in his head, and the impact of the attack badly bruised his legs, arms and torso.

Before sneaking up from behind Kamara in their car with their headlights turned off and then jumping him, the defendants committed a number of other crimes of hatred, according to the District Attorney's office, which is continuing to gather evidence.

They yelled racial slurs from their car at a crowd gathered outside a Stapleton barber shop, where people had gathered to celebrate the historic victory of President-elect Obama.

The FBI and the United States Department of Justice are also investigating the crime, according to the District's Attorney's office.

Attorneys for the defendants would not comment on the incident, but said their clients would make bail.

Family and friends shunned questions from the press, as they ducked out of the courtroom

Garaventa and Nicoletti could face 15 years if convicted.

What would you make fun of him for? All the guy who played him could really do was put on big ears and overdo his pauses while speaking.

It might have been funny if a white guy did that.

The funny thing to do with Obama would be to make him more of a hip-hop, gangsta type black guy. Have him talk like characters on his favorite show, The Wire. But they won't because that would be "racist".

Gen. Petraeus 2012

yeah, because that IS racist, and not based on what he was/is doing. Now for Palin, she is unconsciously a comical figure, I didn't even have to watch SNL.

I heard some comedian talk about this a while back. They have the SNL comedian (don't know his name) do Obama. He's good, and sounds a lot like Obama, has his expressions and manner of speaking down. Yet, so far, there really isn't something they can "jab" with constant jokes.

President Ford only needed to trip and that started a blizzard of jokes. Remember Chevy Chase? Reagan they got with his age and caught his mannerisms perfectly and they were funny. I remember way way back them mocking JFK exaggerating his Boston accent. There was even a comedy album by Vaughn Meter making fun. Oh, and Bush is such a fuck-up, he is a comedans dream. It's impossible to compete with that

If, as time goes on, and we get to know Obama more, and he "trips" or does/says something that would be great material, you can bet the comedians will jump on it. Right now though, I think he's boring material for a comedian anyway.

TIS

The guy who does Obama on SNL doesn't have him "nailed" quite yet. He is going to be hard to impersonate. They did make a move in the right direction last week, however by having a guy impersonate Joe Biden. Although the impression needs work, Biden with all his grins, gaffes, and talking too long is a great source for comedians.

Fred Armisen does Obama and he's doing the best with it that one can. Jason Sudeihes does Biden and it too is the best one can do with it. Neither offers salient personal characteristics to impersonate.

However, Palin's high pitch intonation, her dropping of "Gs" at the end of words, her "oh shucks" expressions, and her glaring lack of knowledge about the Constitution all p[rovided a rich pool of imitatable behavior and mannerisms.

YOU BETCHA

Maverick!

McCain-backer Lieberman keeps Senate chairmanship
Tue Nov 18, 2008 12:54pm EST

By Thomas Ferraro and Richard Cowan

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Senate Democrats on Tuesday yielded to the wishes of President-elect Barack Obama and allowed Joe Lieberman to keep his committee chairmanship despite having backed Republican John McCain for the White House.

At a closed-door meeting, Senate Democrats meted out lesser punishment, passing a resolution of disapproval and stripping Lieberman of the chairmanship of an environment subcommittee.

There were fears that Lieberman, a former Democrat turned independent, might become a Republican if he lost the chairmanship of the Homeland Security Committee.

"This is not a time for retribution," said Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, a Nevada Democrat, adding that "we need to be unified" as the Democratic-led Congress wrestles with a host of problems, including the worst economic crisis since the Great Depression.

"This is all about going forward," Lieberman, flanked by a number of Senate Democrats, told reporters.

Democratic aides said Obama, shortly after winning the November 4 election for the presidency over McCain, urged Democrats to do what it takes to keep Lieberman, who represents Connecticut, in their Senate conference where he routinely votes with them.

Lieberman allowed Democrats to retain control of the Senate, 51-49, the past two years by caucusing with them. Democrats enlarged their Senate majority in the November 4 election, but many believe they could still use Lieberman's vote on a number of issues.

With newly elected Senate Democrats voting, the Democratic conference agreed on a 42-13 tally to allow Lieberman to keep the chairmanship of homeland security as well as a Senate armed services subcommittee, but lose the chairmanship of an environment subcommittee.

Lieberman backed McCain for president largely because McCain, unlike Obama, supported the unpopular Iraq war. In campaigning for McCain, Lieberman routinely ripped into Obama as misguided on what to do about the war, now in its sixth year.

The resolution approved by the Senate Democrats said their caucus "disapproves and rejects statements made by Senator Lieberman against Senator Obama during the campaign for the presidency."

Said Reid, "I defy anyone to be more angry than I was" with Lieberman's words, calling it "a period of time in Joe Lieberman's political career I will never understand or approve."

But Reid then talked about Lieberman's contributions to Senate Democrats and to the country, recounting that as a young man Lieberman traveled to the South to work in the civil rights movement. In 2000, Lieberman, a moderate, was Democratic presidential nominee Al Gore's vice presidential running mate.

Lieberman won re-election to a fourth term in the Senate as an independent in 2006 after losing the Democratic primary due mostly to his support for the Iraq war.

Lieberman then served in the Senate with both presidential candidates -- McCain representing Arizona and Obama serving Illinois until he resigned on Sunday.

ABC News

Clinton's Sec. of State Chances Improving

Obama Staff Vetting Bill Clinton's Foreign Dealings
By JAKE TAPPER

Nov. 18, 2008 —

President-elect Barack Obama is inching closer to naming former rival Sen. Hillary Clinton as his secretary of state, ABC News has learned.

Serious progress has been made in the talks between the two, leaving both Obama and Clinton increasingly optimistic that the assignment will happen, sources say.

Putting Clinton in charge of foreign policy would make for a remarkable partnership, considering the long and bitter primary battles between the two senators for the presidential nomination, and their intense tangles over foreign policy.

Clinton would give the Obama administration someone who is already a familiar face to many foreign heads of state, as well as to foreign populations around the world, who know her and her husband from the Clinton presidency.

Her appointment, however, would also come with complications stemming from Bill Clinton's constant world travels and fundraising among foreigners for his presidential library and William J. Clinton Foundation.

Bill Clinton's ventures are being vetted by Obama attorney Christine Varney, as well as by Obama transition officials, who are known and trusted by the Clintons, as well as by some officials at Clinton's philanthropic foundation to make sure there is nothing that could complicate or compromise an Obama foreign policy.

For instance, the most widely reported example of potential presidential embarrassment or policy complications are reports that Bill Clinton traveled to Kazakhstan in 2005 with mining investor Frank Giustra, despite criticism from U.S. officials, including Hillary Clinton, of the country's human rights record.

Within days of the trip, Giustra's company landed a multimillion dollar deal to buy into uranium projects with Kazakhstan. Months later, Giustra donated $31.3 million to the Clinton foundation, with a pledge of more to come.

Nevertheless, sources familiar with the negotiations believe Clinton's appointment as secretary of state could perhaps happen as early as next week.

Obama has made a point of mending fences with his former rivals. He met with Hillary Clinton at his Chicago transition headquarters last week and sat down Monday with Sen. John McCain, the Republican he defeated on Election Day.

The president-elect also met with New Mexico Gov. Bill Richardson, another one-time presidential contender who later endorsed Obama.

Michael Corleone would have never stood for this Lieberman thing. It would have gone like this:

Michael - You have to answer for what you did Joe.

Lieberman- I swear to God Barack I didn't do anything.

Michael- McCain lost. Palin is back in Alaska. We may have sixty senators without you. We have complete control in the House.

Lieberman - I swear on the kids, Mikey.

Michael - Ahhh that little farce you played with Harry Reid. You think that could fool a Corleone?

Lieberman - I'm innocent.

Michael - Give him a drink. Now tell me who contacted you to attack me on the campaing trail was it McCain or Rove?

Lieberman You've got it all wrong.

Michael - Go ahead take your drink but don't tell me you're innocent because it insults my intelligence and it makes me very angry. Now tell me who approached you?

Lieberman - It was Rove.

Michael - Good. Now get out of my sight.

They just called the Alaska Stevens/Begich race for Begich.




TIS

Does that mean the Dems have the magic # of seats now? Good Lord I hope not.

Hi Mig,

I don't think so. Last I heard I think they were 2 short, but I'm not sure. There's still the Al Franken race that isn't counted but even IF he wins, I think it'll end up very close but not 60. JL or RR probably know the exacts.





TIS

I believe they are currently at 56 + the 2 Independents that vote with them.

Thanks guys.

Ya know he's 85 years old. He needs to retire any way IMHO.

I thought I heard his birthday is today. What a great day (year) for him.




TIS

I think that you actually answered your own question a few sentences down when you went on to say :



Taxes paid to the federal government from these fortunes made from these FAKE dot-coms helped to create a financial surplus in the federal budget which in turn created what seemed like a booming economy. These fortunes that were being made also helped stimulate the economy by the spending that took place from the "cooked" profits that were being made which in turn allows the federal government to curtail federal spending and helps to allow, to what seemed to be, a surplus in the budget to grow.








As I said in that original reply :




Once again, I am in no way defending what took place financially under President Bush and this administartion's watch, but by the same token I refuse to sit back and allow someone to paint a rosey picture for President Clinton and his administration and what was allowed to take place under his watch which made our economy look as though it was booming. What was allowed to take place under his watch caught up to us a few years later and had a big affect on our federal budget and our economy overall.

Both of these administrations are guilty of turning their heads or not being responsible for what has taken place in regards to this country's current negative financial situation. Both contributed in some way to what has now amounted to the financial disaster that we are facing.

Hopefully our President-Elect will live up to his campaign slogan and provide the "change" that he has continually promised us. He himself has said that it's time for "CHANGE" over what we've seen in the last 16 years.


"We need change."

- President Elect Obama



CHANGE!!!!

AND MORE CHANGE!!!!







But sincerely, for all of our sake, I really hope that he can and does bring change, for the better, to this country and it's people.

While I do not absolve Clinton for everything he did, the 2003 legislation which pretty much deregulated everything was really the fina nail in the coffin, and this was under Bush's watch.

Personally I put a great deal of blame on Alan Greenspan. Basically he went along with the false assumption that we could continue to print money, lower interest rates, and give credit to anyone who asked for it. THAT was the fake prosperity of the Clinton and Bush years. I know many people who would max out their credit cards, buy new luxury cars, refinance their house, and then do the same thing over and over. These same people are now bitching that they should be bailed out. As along as people are borrowing money and spending it freely on everything, the economy appears to be far stronger than it is. In the mean time these geniuses on Wall Street were chopping up these bad loans and pawning them off on people betting they would get a return on these "secured" investments, assuming the value of real estate would always be rising. The geniuses, of course then paid themselve huge bonuses, and held all the realy bad paper, overvaluing it enormously.

IMHO Greenspan saw this coming and bailed his sorry ass out and dumped the mess on Bernake and Poulson (I believe Bush is literally running out the clock and is pretty much disengaged at this point).

I am hoping Obama picks Paul Volker for Sec of Treasury, if only for one year. Volker is 81, so all the administrative
and daily briefings etc should be handled by some under secretary to allow Volker and as many brains as he and Obama want to collect go to work on this mess.