And my county can't pass a budget because the County Exec had the nerve to request that the county employees implement a copay on their prescriptions which are currently FREE!! FREE!!!

Oh, wah, wah, wah. Let's not save the county a million bucks while you have job security no matter how poorly you do your job! And benefits for life! Because you don't want to make a nominal COPAY, when so many people don't even have health insurance!

The freaking NERVE.

My daughter hears the same whine from her teachers union.

A real sign of the times...headline in the Atlantic City Press: "Casino earnings tumble: Gross operating profits plunge 23% in traditionally strong quarter (summer)." The article goes on to say that profits were ONLY $318 mil compared to $412 mil for the same period last year. Even the Borgata has laid off people. There are 11 casinos in A.C. and a few of them are really hurting. Besides the economy, they are blaming legalized slots in PA and the smoking ban, which has now been lifted.

You got to know when to hold 'em, know when to fold 'em.

I got a couple e-mails from Southwest Airline with Vegas New Year's Eve air/hotel deals. The prices really are not bad compared to past years. You can tell the economy sucks when Vegas is trying o book for New Year's Eve, this late in the year.


TIS

Citigroup is planning on selling itself??

It was on the news... try reading some of it instead of trying to find out if Paul Bennett is alive or not.

Check out the link below (I assume you know how to read):

CITIGROUP FOR SALE? - CLICK HERE

I don't know how to read!

SC, I saw that about Citigroup. But didn't they also just buy Wachovia? Or did they lose out to Wells Fargo? It's so hard to keep track!

The news is just awful. I felt fairly certain that the Dow would stay over 8,000, and it closed yesterday barely over 7,500. I really hope we have hit bottom, but who knows??

No surprise there.... you just know how to copy other's words.

With the largest (or second largest) nation's bank stock dropping by 50% it's a particularly scary and uneasy market now. The auto bailout failure also doesn't help.

It should be interesting to see what the market does today.

You know, coming from Michigan, I had many family/friends working for the Auto industry (factory mostly). It's been years, and I've lost track of who works where, and many are probably retired now. I surely don't want to see thousands more lose their jobs and I am not necessarily against this bailout, BUT the more I hear the more I do blame the auto industry CEOs and their greed and/or poor management, or whatever.

I do think the must come up with a "plan" as Pelosi said. How can we just hand over money if nothing will change. What's sad is these companies have known and been urged to, for a long time now, work on alternative fuel ideas and they haven't.

I am no expert on the inner makings of these companies, but shouldn't they high-ups (or whomever) take the responsiblity? Or seriously, what if they did file bankruptcy, could they do that and then try to get back on their feet? Like I say, I'm no expert on this, but wondering. It's just a a shame that the average harding working, Blue Collar Joes lose their jobs because of their greed no?


TIS

That's what it usually comes down to, TIS. Corporate greed. As Gecko said, Greed is good, to an extent. There's nothing wrong with making a tidy profit. As a matter of fact, profit's a wonderful thing. Honest profit.

The CEOs of the Motown Three went to Washington to beg for money. There was a local news reporter who said that all three arrived in separate private jets. Yes, because that's the message you want to send when you're asking for a hand-out. "Oh, no billions for me?? Well, let me just hop on my private jet and fly back to break the news to the guy who dyes the tail-lights red."

The way these once-great companies have been ruined is truly disgusting. The biggest fear with their bankruptcy is what happens to the workers who have a massive amount of their pension funds invested in company stock. Otherwise, I wouldn't give a damn.

In my opinion, the autos shouldn't be bailed out. The execs say it's the financial crisis that's hurting them. That's true, but their number one problem is that they make cars that no one wants to buy. It's as simple as that. You have to let them fail. They must get out of their onerous contracts with the UAW and right-size their capacity. Companies don't fire people because they go into bankrupcty - they fire people because their business model doesn't work and there isn't enough demand to feed their supply.

You are 100% right, DS. I drove a Buick, and it was my 3rd GM. It was not an inexpensive car by any means. It had 46,000 miles on it when I turned it in. I had replaced 6 tires on the car. I had it aligned, it had never been in an accident, and I had the tires rotated every other oil change. The buttons on the radio had chipped paint, the leather on the seats was cheap. The housing on one of the fog lights was broken. When you moved the front seats forward, you could see the housing for the power seats from the back of the car if you bent down. Oh, and it handled like crap. My husband referred to it as the sow on wheels. And even though it was supposed to get 28 mpg on the highway, in all the four years I leased it, I never got more than 17.5 overall.

I leased GMs because I thought that they were decent cars. The Rendezvous, which I had before this one, had heat that didn't work. The fan would blow like crazy, but the it would take forever for it to get warm. GM even sent someone from the factory to try and fix it, and paid for a rental car for me while they worked on it. They never were able to fix it. Their solution? Shrug their shoulders and give it back.

GMAC used to offer incentives to keep their GM customers, letting you out of leases early if you leased another car. With the current credit crunch, plus the fact that they got hosed on residuals for all their giant SUVS, they're now out of the leasing business. They had nothing to offer me.

I couldn't wait to dump it and get my nice Honda Accord.

An editorial in our local paper suggested that Exxon (and other oil profiteers) bailout the auto companies, since it's their gas hogs that have contributed to Exxons obscene profits.

McDonald's will start selling healthy food before that ever happens.

The Dow recovered nicely today!

At least it's back over 8,000 again.

I don't know how accurate this is, but my daughter just sent me this via e-mail, showing stores that will be closing. I thought I'd pass it on. I do know of some of these closings, but didn't realize how many more there are.


TIS



Before you get your loved ones gift cards or if you have any already - ready this e-mail please


Stores that are planning to close after
Christmas are still selling the cards through the holidays even though
the cards will be worthless January 1. There is no law preventing them
from doing this. On the contrary, it is referred to as 'Bankrupcy
Planning). Below is a partial list of stores that you need to be
cautious about.

Circuit City (filed Chapter 11)
Ann Taylor- 117 stores nationwide closing
Lane Bryant, Fashion Bug ,and Catherine's to close 150 stores
nationwide
Eddie Bauer to close stores 27 stores and more after January
Cache will close all stores
Talbots closing down specialty stores J. Jill closing all stores (owned by Talbots)
Pacific Sunwear (also owned by Talbots)
GAP closing 85 stores
Footlocker closing 140 stores mo re to close after January
Wickes Furniture closing down
Levitz closing down remaining stores
Bombay closing remaining stores
Zales closing down 82 stores and 105 after January
Whitehall closing all stores
Piercing Pagoda closing all stores
Disney closing 98 stores and will close more after January.
Home Depot closing 15 stores 1 in NJ ( New Brunswick )
Macys to close 9 stores after January
Linens and Things closing all stores
Movie Galley Closing all stores
Pep Boys Closing 33 stores
Sprint/Nextel closing 133 stores
JC Penney closing a number of stores after January
Ethan Allen closing down 12 stores.
Wilson Leather closing down all stores
Sharper Image closing down all stor~s
K B Toys closing 356 stores
Loews to close down some stores
Dillard's to close some stores

TIS, the list is scary. As much as I would love to get cheap stuff during holidays, this is the scary face of recession.

Some of the list is not so shocking, like maybe Wickes or Pacific Sunwear, where they are more I don't know, specialty type stores. But, J.C. Penny and Pep Boys (Big here in SoCal) really surprise me. Pennys is everywhere it seems and use to be a major department store.


TIS

Snopes: "Mixture of Accurate, Innacurate and Outdated Information"

http://www.snopes.com/politics/business/storeclosings.asp

You can find specifics there, after the email examples...

Also, even if a chain closes SOME of its stores, it doesn't necessarily mean much. Stores will often up new stores and close others as demographics change. Also, through mergers and acquisitions, stores find themselves with duplication of effort. When Filenes and Macy's merged, many stores closed because Filene's and Macy's were often in the same mall, or at least had stores so close to one another that they couldn't possibly do enough sales to sustain two locations.

That said, it is still a damn scary list.

We may need the Ragman back.

Do any of you think that this economy crisis is much much worse than most think? I read a story from Bloomberg news today (for some reason I can't copy/paste the link) indicating we are very close to a depression but no one is saying so.

And, on a personal level, it IS affecting my job. Myself and another girl in my office do more or less the same job(we split it). She has been out on disabiliy now nearly all school year and I have had to handle the full load. We all got a letter from the district saying we should "expect" bigger work loads and that they are not hiring for the most part. I have come to the conclusion that they are not even going to attempt to replace this girl. This was more or less confirmed by the Principal (in so many words) who politely told me the same thing. I don't mind working hard at all, but I am only one person and can do only so much and I am pissed!!
I don't mind telling you that I am ready to pull my hair out. Friday was he worse (and busiest) day for me ever.

Even our wonderful Governor told everyone (the schools) to expect many more cuts in not only programs but employees. Thus perhaps (for me anyway)the upside......which is, the possibility of the "golden handshake" in which the district offers long term individuals a package to early retirement enabling them to cut jobs and if they rehire will rehire will less wages and fewer benefits. Not good for anyone else I'm afraid, but I'd jump at an offer. Rumor has it, that they might offer it this year. God, I hope so, cause baby I am soooooooooo there. In any case, next school year will be my last unless I just can't take the bullishit anymore and leave before this year is up. I'm ready!

TIS

It's always worse. Unemployment next month will top 7% and I predict 9% next year. Of course, there are also the underemployed - those who would like to work full-time, but can't find such jobs.

As far as a depresson goes, keep in mind that in the 30s the unemployment rate exceeded 25%. I don't think we'll get much above 9%. So, no depression.

I read a great definition of the difference between a recession and a depression.

If your neighbor is out of work, it's a recession. If you lose your job, it's a depression.

Woolworths,the famous chain of shops,99 years old is going down the tubes with the loss of 800 shops and 30,000 jobs

This sucks big style!

Administrators are trying to find a buyer but it looks grim. In the meantime the ailing shops are having a half price "everything must go" sale. Their shops are apparently being overwhelmed with bargain hunters fighting over half priced pieces of junk.

I find it distasteful that people are fighting over stuff whilst knowing that a lot of people are possibly going to lose their jobs

Office Depot looks like it is headed down.