Seems like the Zetas are getting desperate in getting people into their organization. Acapulco is a cluster fuck right now, the remaindants of the Beltran Leyva organization are all fighting each other for extortion rackets and retail drug sales. The women killed were probably prostitutes wanting to remain independent. Many of the people found in the graves where Central American illegal immigrants, as you probably know the Zetas are heavy into human trafficking. These immigrants probably didn't pay the "tax" or to pass thru their territory. The mastermind behind all the graves in Tamulipas was already captured, it was "El Kilo" a Zeta cell leader. It's astonishing how the street gangs or remaindants of the Beltran Leyva organization are responsible for most of the innocents being killed.

I live in Texas, have friends from Mexico and have been watching this shit for years. It astounds me that it gets as little media attention as it does, particularly when you consider that 30,000 people have died in the last few years.

The violence and impact on Mexican society is staggering. If you want to follow what is happening, the best online resource I have found is BorderLand Beat (http://www.borderlandbeat.com/).

If I can figure out how to post files, I have some PDF's of government reports on the cartels and approaches to deal with the problem that may be of interest.

How can anyone slit the throat of a 14 year old girl? Or just any girl??? It makes me physically sick to read stories like this.

In my opinion they are way worse.At least the Al-Qaeda have some semblance of political beliefs or ideology behind their actions.Also they strike at the West,not their own people.These cartel animals kill their own people,shoot up school busses just for kicks.

Sad as it may be,I think the violence in the past few years is a sign that their time is coming to an end.It's always darkest before dawn.
Alot of people make a big fuss about how powerful they are but I feel they're not all they're cracked up to be.First of all they are morons.You cannot fight a war against your own government.They didn't learn anything from the Columbians or the Sicilians.Both were stronger than the Mexicans and both were defeated.Even in a country as fucked up as Mexico things will only go so far.They should have stopped shooting at eachother and accepted a smaller piece of the pie.A smaller piece of something is better than nothing,which is what they're going to get when Mexico and/or the US get their shit together.

Also,like others said,most of their soldiers are coked up teenage retards.They aren't any smarter or tougher than your average US Blood or Crip gangmember.You hear these reports about them 'training' children or attractive women as hitmen and some view it as a sign of sophistication or power,but the truth is they're forced to do it.As more and more are getting killed they are scraping the bottom of the barrel for their recruits.They are less in numbers and lesser in quality.

You can email those files to the their email address, I want to look at those files myself. I have too have been following the news almost daily but borderland beat isn't that informative on the cartels or the drug war overall. The spanish blog del narco, diaro del narco etc. websites are way more informative and accurate.

I have a feeling you don't know what you're talking about like most people here on what's going on in Mexico. Felipe Calderon's PAN party heavily pressured/assisted by the United States deployed 45,000 military troops and 10,000 federal forces to combat the 6 major drug trafficking organizations in late 2006/early 2007. Most of the 36,000 dead + are criminals killing criminals, sure the cartels sometimes engage the federal police or military but they only do it as a last resort or to protect some local cell leader, local boss, state boss etc. Most of the violence towards civilians come from the Zetas/remandants of the Beltran Leyva organization, both of these groups are very desperate right now but of course then you have street gangs working for these splintered factions/cells causing more chaos. It will take about more 4-5 years to truly dismantle the cartels in Mexico. I find it laughable that people think cartel gunmen are trained as soldier, yes their "trained" but only like 2 weeks or so. The average age for a cartel soldier are 20 years to 30 years old, the "halcones" are mostly teenagers but they also have police, bus drivers, taxi drivers etc. I find it amazing that the country with the 13th largest economy in the world has to resort to their military to fight/dismantle drug trafficking groups. I personally think that the Mexican cartels are the only criminal groups that truly shows their power, you have to get 300 soldiers and marines in order to capture a cartel boss. I don't see the same happening with Mafia bosses honestly.

You seem to be well versed on the subject so I'll take your word for it.They have been deployed doing what?Also perhaps just military might is not enough?Don't they have some intelligence service,some way to get info on the cartel leaders?What use is having 50 thousand solders if they don't know where to find their targets?

So what you're saying is that the violence is ok as long as its just "criminals killing criminals".Also I don't know about sometimes.Seems like every other week you hear about kids being slaughtered at a house party,a school bus shot up,a politician kidnapped etc.
.
That was my point.They make it out to be like the cartels have some highly trained private army at their disposal.Terms like "assassin" are thrown around.The truth is that they just recruit poor kids,teach them the basics of not shooting themselves with their own guns,and send them out.They'll soon get killed,rinse and repeat.You can do that in any place where you have poverty,it's not indicative of some great power.In Africa with a few million you can recruit and arm probably a thousand people.It doesn't matter because you'll only be able to operate in Africa.


Perhaps our definitions of power differ,and that's ok,but I don't see what the big deal is.It takes 300 soldiers because the cartel boss and his guys are cornered,have no chance of escape,so they decide to go out blasting.You have a better chance going on the run than shutting yourself in some safehouse with 30 guys waiting for the army to get you.

They are definitely more powerful than the Italian Mafia right now, probably on the same level or more as Sicily's Cosa Nostra in the 1980s and early 1990s.

I also have read these reports frequently. And I don't really see the difference between splinter groups/cells or street gangs hired by the cartels and the cartels itself.

I get a feeling HermitKermit is somehow trying to defend these guys.

So you don't see the difference between the violence in Juarez and the violence in Durango, Tamaulipas, Nuevo Leon, Sinaloa etc.? I'm not trying to defend the cartels, I'm just saying how it is. There is a big difference and if you can't tell me what's the difference than I'll tell you.

Ugh I don't know where to start with you. Felipe Calderon deployed 45,000 and 10,000 Federal police to combat the 6 major drug trafficking organizations with support of the U.S government via intelligence and training the federal/military. I don't care about the violence honestly I hope they kill off each other, you're putting words in my mouth. The house party killings happened in Juarez between rival gangs supported/financed by either the Sinaloa Cartel or the La Linea(Juarez Cartel), I have never heard of a school bus being shot up, and yes a LOT of police commanders of all levels have lost their lives. They are assassins but of course they don't have the training of a soldier but still the guns, grenades, ammo and other equipment costs a LOT of money. In terms of shooting skills I'll have to go like this Mexican soldiers/marines>federal police>state police=cartel gunmen>municipal police. Well of course they use poor people to do their dirty work and die for them, it's like that everywhere. When I meant power is that Mexico has to resort to their military to go after the cartels, if it wasn't for the military Mexico would be in a very big trouble. Cartel gunmen avoid the military at all cost hence that's why the cartels have "halcones"/informants to inform them about the presence of the military or rivals. The video I posted where some black SUV did a drive by to the Marines, well in that video 6 police officers and 3 cartel gunmen were trying to rescue "El Teacher" a Zeta cell leader in Monterrey, they were too late in that one. But they typical block roads and the cartel gunmen distract the miltary until the cell leader, local boss, state boss etc. Of course the hirer the ranking of the cartel member the more security it has, the core group rarely does the fighting though. I wouldn't be surprised if the core group had ex-soldiers as body guards, El Chapo is rumored to have 300 ex-soldiers/soldiers ready to protect him if the government finds him and tries to take him out.

You obviously know a lot more than me about the cartels. But I think it's pretty much a fact that members of the cartels are responsible for the killings of woman and children, based on various reliable news reports. And should it make a difference that the woman were supposedly prostitutes?

State police vs Federal Police.

When you mean killing woman and children, what do you really mean? You mean intentionally killing innocent women and children? When hundreds of bullets are flying it's bound to hit innocent people. Now there are some women that join the cartels and a rival will kill them even if they are women. Besides the Artistas Asesinos, Barrio Azteca, and other gangs etc. killing 16 people in order to kill 4 of their rivals in a house party. Or the Zetas killing immigrants that don't pay "quota" or refusing to join them. I haven't heard much news of cartels intentionally killing innocent people that had nothing to do with them.

Hermit and anyone else,

Get me your email address and I will send the reports. They are too big for this board, some are 9 MB.

Titles include:

A Line in the Sand - Confronting the Threat at the Border - Dept of Homeland Security

At a CrossRoads - Drug Traffic Violence & Mexican State - WOLA Briefing Paper (Washington Office on Latin America)

Common Enemy Common Struggle (US Senate)

Criminal Activity on the Southern Border - US House

Drug Policy on US Mexico - Merida Initiative - WOLA

Mexico's Drug Cartels - US Congress

State of Siege - WOLA (outstanding)

All are PDF's and some can be found on the web, others are not.

I think the above debate on comparing what is happening in Mexico to any LCN or Sicilian Mafia activity is apples and oranges.

What is happening in Mexico is arguably described as a civil war. IMO, the outcome of the government efforts to crack down on narco trafficking, political corruption and judicial corruption will shape Mexican society, politics and culture for the next decades.

I doubt that LCN or the Sicilian Mafia have killed 30,000 people in their history, let alone in a 5 year time span.

EarniesWorld@hotmail.com is my email. How did you get hold of these papers/data?

Hermit,

Docs are on their way.

In terms of power, the major Mexican cartels are certainly comparable to other international crime groups but the war down in Mexico is precisely because the cartels are under siege. Since the government crackdown in 2006, their smuggling routes have been pressured and they're fighting over shrinking territory. Though on a smaller scale in terms of body count, the same thing happened in both Sicily and Colombia.

Here's an interactive map showing the changing cartel territories in Mexico from late 2008 to early 2011.


http://www1.stratfor.com/images/interactive/Mexico_Drug_Cartels.html



December 2006: Mexican President Felipe Calderon takes office, promising to fight back against drug cartels. His first two years in office show strong successes against the cartels, with large drug seizures and the capture of several organizations’ leaders. The government’s chief target is the Gulf cartel, the most powerful in Mexico.


December 2008: A two-year-long campaign by the Calderon government against the Gulf cartel has left it crippled. The cartel’s enforcement arm, Los Zetas, splintered off in spring 2008 and now controls much of what used to be Gulf territory. The government’s success is a double-edged sword, however: The decline of the Gulf cartel has left a large power vacuum, encouraging other organizations — and factions within those organizations — to fight to increase their influence.


December 2009: As the government pressures powerful cartels, the situation in Mexico becomes more volatile and two distinct but interconnected wars begin to emerge: the government’s fight against the cartels, and the cartels’ fights between and among themselves. The geography of cartel influence does not change significantly, though one notable exception to this is the rise of the infamous La Familia Michoacana (LFM), which has captured media attention by marrying drug-trafficking activities to a pseudo-religious ideology.


May 2010: A major rift emerges in the Beltran Leyva Organization (BLO) after the death of leader Arturo “El Jefe de Jefes” Beltran Leyva. Two factions emerge, one under Arturo’s brother, Hector, and the other made up of elements of the BLO’s brutal enforcement wing and run by Edgar “La Barbie” Valdez Villarreal.


December 2010: Tensions between the Gulf cartel and Los Zetas also have boiled over into open war in the country’s east, with the Gulf cartel reaching out to its former rivals in Sinaloa as well as LFM to align under the name “New Federation” and pushing Los Zetas from one of their traditional strongholds, Reynosa, though not out of Nuevo Laredo or Monterrey. In its weakened state, Los Zetas began increasing operations outside the normal scope of drug trafficking, such as kidnapping for ransom, and giving rise to a trend that STRATFOR eventually would dub Mexico’s third war: that of the cartels on the Mexican public. Cartel-related violence in the country reaches new heights, with more than 11,000 deaths on record.


April 2011: Violence continues to rise in all parts of the country. The Sinaloa Federation continues to expand its territory north and east, taking over areas formerly under the influence of the Carrillo Fuentes Organization and the Arellano Felix Organization. With the help of Sinaloa, the Gulf cartel has been able to repel offenses from Los Zetas in Reynosa and Matamoros, though the Zetas are proving resilient. LFM appeared to implode in January, but now a large subset of the former LFM seems to have simply rebranded itself as the “Knights Templar.” Its size and capabilities remain unclear.
Paz, Buela

http://borderland-beat.924382.n3.nabble....-td2878228.html

Seems like the once powerful Tijuana and Juarez cartels are almost finished.

It also seems like Los Zetas is more powerful than the Gulf cartel?

I heard somewhere that the Cartel del Pacifico, la Familia and possibly the Gulf Cartel have joined together and call themselves the "united Cartels" or i have also heard they are calling themselves "La Resistencia" (The resistence)

Basically it seems everyone is teaming up to fight off los zetas and then they will go back to fighting each other..lol. It will never end.

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/topstory/7607122.html
"The elderly are killed. Young women are raped. And able-bodied men are given hammers, machetes and sticks and forced to fight to the death."

What a disgusting situation. The place needs a revolution and law enforcement that can't be corrupted so easily.

Some reports say that the zetas are weak now and r made up of small time thieves and junkies and some say they r the 2nd strongest.I think the zetas r able to recruit because they pay their men very well

How do the cartels in the south of mexico like lafamilia transport their drugs to america??dont they have to go near the border tows who r controlled by other cartels

How much is the average cartel soldier getting paid?

$500 as just a retainer plus about $50000 per hit or few kilos of cocane.That is what they gave those 2 teenage hitmen from texas

Over 50 people die in Mexico casino firebombing -

http://www.miamiherald.com/2011/08/26/2375735/more-than-53-die-in-firebombing.html

Yeah just saw that on the news today...I wonder if 2011 will top the ridiculous cartel-related homicide total of 2010!