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Re: Who Put The Hit On Joe Colombo?
[Re: Scorsese]
#695121
02/07/13 07:36 PM
02/07/13 07:36 PM
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Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 2,418 Secret location (WITSEC)
HairyKnuckles
Underboss
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Underboss
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 2,418
Secret location (WITSEC)
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it does sound pretty plausible but why would he think to go straight after colombo why not russo.
Heres some stuff from the fbi files. On June 29 – the day after the Colombo shooting – Scarpa told G-men the following:
Informant continued that he has learned that JOHNSON was "a would be Black wise guy" and hung out in Greenwich Village. Informant said JOHNSON never had the reputation of being a militant or a "kook" and that JOHNSON had often visited social clubs and after hours joints in Brooklyn, NY. Informant said he heard that JOHNSON once befriended never forgets this and was the type of person who if approached correctly would "do anything" for a price.
Just weeks before Colombo was gunned down the mob boss told Scarpa that his home had been cased by an apparent crew of black gangsters, and on June 10 Scarpa recounted that conversation to the FBI:
On 6/10/71, informant advised that he had recently met with Joe Colombo at which time COLOMBO confided that during the previous week he had been told that a car containing a number of Negro individuals was observed circling his block many times in the early AM hours. COLOMBO stated it is well known that GALLO had become friendly with Negro hoodlums while incarcerated and also believes it is possible that GALLO has enlisted their aid at the present time. COLOMBO concluded however that it is his personal feeling at present that GALLO is merely trying to "intimidate and shake me up" by having such an obvious play utilized. COLOMBO stated he is continuing to press for massive turnout on 6/28/71.
Carlo Gambino was not alone in his growing frustration with Joe Colombo's personal battle against the FBI. Indeed, Colombo's own associates were distancing themselves from the mob boss according to Scarpa. For example, on 6/15/71, Scarpa recounted for the FBI a conversation he had with pornographer Nicholas Bianco who was severing his ties with Colombo to ally with the Patriarcas:
On 6/15/71, informant advised that on the previous day he had had a long conversation with NICHOLAS BIANCO at which time BIANCO expressed great disgust with COLOMBO who BIANCO characterized as "crazy." BIANCO made clear to informant that he intended to "pull away" from COLOMBO and in this regard had purchased a home in Providence and will make a gradual "withdrawal." Informant said BIANCO stated that "we are all going to be arrested, it is inevitable, there is no way out," obviously referring to the fact that COLOMBO was "putting heat" on everyone who is close to him.
Colombo had told Gambino that the Civil Rights League rally would be his "swan song" according to Scarpa but little did Colombo know at the time how prophetic his words would become. The day after the Colombo hit Scarpa told the FBI:
Informant continued that approximately thirty minutes prior to the time COLOMBO was shot he had a discussion with him during which time COLOMBO advised that although GAMBINO was not furnishing him any support for this rally that he had assured GAMBINO that this would be his "swan song" and that in the future he would take a back seat to all the IACRL activities devoting himself to humanitarian causes such as boys camps, hospitals and the like and would refrain from fighting the FBI. COLOMBO stated that they should therefore not be too disappointed if the rally was not a huge success that they had hoped for. Russo was indicted twice, but acquitted both times. Maybe his acquittals spurred Johnson to believe that Russo´s boss, Colombo, had "fixed" the case, behind the scene, using Colombo Family´s influence within the judicial system. Perhaps this was part of the motive behind the shooting? Note that Scarpa doesn´t explain the shooting, but only gives some background to what he thinks can be the reason for it. A car with black gangsters circulating the Colombo home, doesn´t mean the blacks were sent by Gallo. If Johnson was part of some kind of a Black Panther movement and if the Colombo shooting was part of some kind of (what they considered) a racial war, the blacks in the car may possibly have been Johnson´s friends. The Colombo/Gallo tension was there. But somehow I have a gut feeling that the Gallos were not behind the Colombo shooting. According to Cantalupo, Joey Gallo renounced any responsibility in the shooting. Considering his boldness and his fondness for bragging, his renouncement doesn´t sound very "Joey Galloish". If Colombo had assured Gambino that this would be his "swan song" and that in the future he would take a back seat to all the IACRL activities, I wonder why Carlo Gambino would have had any motives of killing him? The damage of exposing the Mafia was already done.
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Re: Who Put The Hit On Joe Colombo?
[Re: HairyKnuckles]
#695132
02/07/13 08:01 PM
02/07/13 08:01 PM
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Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 3,571
Scorsese
Underboss
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Underboss
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 3,571
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it does sound pretty plausible but why would he think to go straight after colombo why not russo.
Heres some stuff from the fbi files. On June 29 – the day after the Colombo shooting – Scarpa told G-men the following:
Informant continued that he has learned that JOHNSON was "a would be Black wise guy" and hung out in Greenwich Village. Informant said JOHNSON never had the reputation of being a militant or a "kook" and that JOHNSON had often visited social clubs and after hours joints in Brooklyn, NY. Informant said he heard that JOHNSON once befriended never forgets this and was the type of person who if approached correctly would "do anything" for a price.
Just weeks before Colombo was gunned down the mob boss told Scarpa that his home had been cased by an apparent crew of black gangsters, and on June 10 Scarpa recounted that conversation to the FBI:
On 6/10/71, informant advised that he had recently met with Joe Colombo at which time COLOMBO confided that during the previous week he had been told that a car containing a number of Negro individuals was observed circling his block many times in the early AM hours. COLOMBO stated it is well known that GALLO had become friendly with Negro hoodlums while incarcerated and also believes it is possible that GALLO has enlisted their aid at the present time. COLOMBO concluded however that it is his personal feeling at present that GALLO is merely trying to "intimidate and shake me up" by having such an obvious play utilized. COLOMBO stated he is continuing to press for massive turnout on 6/28/71.
Carlo Gambino was not alone in his growing frustration with Joe Colombo's personal battle against the FBI. Indeed, Colombo's own associates were distancing themselves from the mob boss according to Scarpa. For example, on 6/15/71, Scarpa recounted for the FBI a conversation he had with pornographer Nicholas Bianco who was severing his ties with Colombo to ally with the Patriarcas:
On 6/15/71, informant advised that on the previous day he had had a long conversation with NICHOLAS BIANCO at which time BIANCO expressed great disgust with COLOMBO who BIANCO characterized as "crazy." BIANCO made clear to informant that he intended to "pull away" from COLOMBO and in this regard had purchased a home in Providence and will make a gradual "withdrawal." Informant said BIANCO stated that "we are all going to be arrested, it is inevitable, there is no way out," obviously referring to the fact that COLOMBO was "putting heat" on everyone who is close to him.
Colombo had told Gambino that the Civil Rights League rally would be his "swan song" according to Scarpa but little did Colombo know at the time how prophetic his words would become. The day after the Colombo hit Scarpa told the FBI:
Informant continued that approximately thirty minutes prior to the time COLOMBO was shot he had a discussion with him during which time COLOMBO advised that although GAMBINO was not furnishing him any support for this rally that he had assured GAMBINO that this would be his "swan song" and that in the future he would take a back seat to all the IACRL activities devoting himself to humanitarian causes such as boys camps, hospitals and the like and would refrain from fighting the FBI. COLOMBO stated that they should therefore not be too disappointed if the rally was not a huge success that they had hoped for. Russo was indicted twice, but acquitted both times. Maybe his acquittals spurred Johnson to believe that Russo´s boss, Colombo, had "fixed" the case, behind the scene, using Colombo Family´s influence within the judicial system. Perhaps this was part of the motive behind the shooting? Note that Scarpa doesn´t explain the shooting, but only gives some background to what he thinks can be the reason for it. A car with black gangsters circulating the Colombo home, doesn´t mean the blacks were sent by Gallo. If Johnson was part of some kind of a Black Panther movement and if the Colombo shooting was part of some kind of (what they considered) a racial war, the blacks in the car may possibly have been Johnson´s friends. The Colombo/Gallo tension was there. But somehow I have a gut feeling that the Gallos were not behind the Colombo shooting. According to Cantalupo, Joey Gallo renounced any responsibility in the shooting. Considering his boldness and his fondness for bragging, his renouncement doesn´t sound very "Joey Galloish". If Colombo had assured Gambino that this would be his "swan song" and that in the future he would take a back seat to all the IACRL activities, I wonder why Carlo Gambino would have had any motives of killing him? The damage of exposing the Mafia was already done. I mean scarpa even said that he wasn't a kook or militant and if he was we probably would have heard about it by now any sort of black panther connection would have been major news at that time, but even the league felt that wasnt the case.It seems more like he was some freelance independent criminal and hustler, colombo seems like a bit of a random target for revenge in that situation. What was russos status within the family? Was he killed?
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Re: Who Put The Hit On Joe Colombo?
[Re: Don Cardi]
#695253
02/08/13 12:48 PM
02/08/13 12:48 PM
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Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 290 ATL
SilentPartnerz
Capo
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Capo
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 290
ATL
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On June 29, 1971, Joseph Columbo, the boss of the Columbo Cosa Nostra Family, made his way to the platform to deliver his speech at the Italian-American Civil Rights League Rally in Columbus Circle. About three feet away was a black man holding a camera. Just as Colombo began to read his speech the black man threw down the camera, took out a pistol and shot Columbo three times in the back of the head and neck. The black man was apprehended immediately but while the police wrestled him on the floor, a man emerged from the crowd and shot the black man dead. This man managed to escape through the crowd. The black man was identified as Jerome Johnson.
Was it on the orders of Crazy Joe Gallo? Orders from Carlo Gambino? Did Gambino give the go ahead to Joe Gallo? Or Did Gambino..or someone else for that matter...hire a black man to shoot Columbo to make it look as though Crazy Joe was behind the hit?
Your thoughts? CARLO GAMBINO.
"Three can keep a secret..if two are dead." Calogero Minacore
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Re: Who Put The Hit On Joe Colombo?
[Re: Giancarlo]
#695326
02/08/13 05:54 PM
02/08/13 05:54 PM
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Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 290 ATL
SilentPartnerz
Capo
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Capo
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 290
ATL
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Carlo Gambino and Tommy Lucchese made Joe Colombo the boss of the family. He alerted them to Joe Bonnano and Joe Malyak's takeover plot. This was his reward . They held tremendous sway over Joe Colombo. When Joe Colombo went on the Dick Cavett Show, it was curtains for his ass. Mob boss on national tv? What did he expect. Supposedly, Gambino told him to give the Ital. Civil Rights president job over to someone else. He was drawing too much attention to himself, and by association, to Carlo and Three Fingers Brown. Pop! Next boss please.
Last edited by SilentPartnerz; 02/08/13 05:55 PM.
"Three can keep a secret..if two are dead." Calogero Minacore
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Re: Who Put The Hit On Joe Colombo?
[Re: Giancarlo]
#695329
02/08/13 05:56 PM
02/08/13 05:56 PM
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Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 290 ATL
SilentPartnerz
Capo
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Capo
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 290
ATL
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In 1974 didn't Gambino order the Colombo's to kill one of their own, Carmine "Mimi" Scialo? Supposedly for insulting Gambino in public? A few weeks after he insulted Carlo they found Mimi encased in cement. I'm pretty sure the Colombo's did the job but it was on Carlo's order. Could be the Gambino's did it themselves but i read somewhere he had the Colombo's do it. Anyone know anymore on that? Yep. Joey Cantalupo tells this story in Crime, Inc. episode - All In The Family.
"Three can keep a secret..if two are dead." Calogero Minacore
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Re: Who Put The Hit On Joe Colombo?
[Re: Giancarlo]
#695342
02/08/13 06:39 PM
02/08/13 06:39 PM
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Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 290 ATL
SilentPartnerz
Capo
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Capo
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 290
ATL
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Yep. Joey Cantalupo tells this story in Crime, Inc. episode - All In The Family.
Thanks, i'll have to check that out on YouTube. Jerry Capeci did a pretty decent piece on Cantalupo for New York Magazine back in 1980. Not a bad read, check it out if you've never read it. It starts on page 32 in the magazine. http://books.google.com/books?id=t-UCAAAAMBAJ&pg=PA32 Thanks dude! Now I have something to do until I leave work! Awesome!
"Three can keep a secret..if two are dead." Calogero Minacore
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Re: Who Put The Hit On Joe Colombo?
[Re: Scorsese]
#695429
02/09/13 07:04 AM
02/09/13 07:04 AM
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Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 132 East US
Viceguy
ManOnTheMake
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ManOnTheMake
Made Member
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 132
East US
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In the hood there was always talk that this was a Gallo joint. I remember dudes going around claiming some connect with Joey. We thought it was a cool thing when Joey 'came out'. But most of was bs, everybody wants to be a gangster. These guys didn't know any more than I did.
N..... or no, bastard had balls, shame to kill him... I got nuthin', I got nuthin...
Coming to bb is like going to the dollar store. You came for one thing, but once in now youse cant leave.
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Re: Who Put The Hit On Joe Colombo?
[Re: SilentPartnerz]
#695440
02/09/13 09:40 AM
02/09/13 09:40 AM
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Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 2,418 Secret location (WITSEC)
HairyKnuckles
Underboss
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Underboss
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 2,418
Secret location (WITSEC)
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In 1974 didn't Gambino order the Colombo's to kill one of their own, Carmine "Mimi" Scialo? Supposedly for insulting Gambino in public? A few weeks after he insulted Carlo they found Mimi encased in cement. I'm pretty sure the Colombo's did the job but it was on Carlo's order. Could be the Gambino's did it themselves but i read somewhere he had the Colombo's do it. Anyone know anymore on that? Yep. Joey Cantalupo tells this story in Crime, Inc. episode - All In The Family. Cantalupo says this in his book also. But there may be other reasons as well Mimi Scialo was wacked. According to Greg Scarpa, Alphonse Persico, the Family consigliere at the time, informed him of the fact that Scialo had recruited some young turks who secretly did dirty work for Scialo. Scialo refused to reveal the identities of these guys which infuriated Persico. He suspected that Scialo was planning to take over the Family. Later, the FBI was informed that Scialo was hit because he had become a liability to the Family, when the bosses found out that Scialo was undergoing psychiatric treatment. In addition, Scialo had also shot a made member during a sitdown when Scialo´s murder of a Colombo associate, named Miguel Cosmos, was being discussed.
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Re: Who Put The Hit On Joe Colombo?
[Re: Facchia]
#695483
02/09/13 06:25 PM
02/09/13 06:25 PM
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Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 282 Nuevo Mexico
Vigil
Capo
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Capo
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 282
Nuevo Mexico
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Who would have the most to gain by Colombo going? Carmine Persico by far, mind you he was not on the street but had a very strong crew. Michael Franzese believed that Carmine Persico played a role in his father's(Sonny Franzese)bank robbing conviction. With Franzese gone who else would stand in the way of Persico grabbing the top spot? With his strong crew on the street Carmine could easily know how unhappy people were w/Colombo. So Snake hires a black man to do the job knowing that Gallo will catch the heat for it and not the Persico crew. Gambino is fine as long as Colombo goes away and the civil rights B/S dies with Colombo & the hired hand(Johnson). Well said. & I agree.
*** il capo di tutti capi ***
"You'll never meet another guy like me if you live to be 5, 000." -John Gotti
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Re: Who Put The Hit On Joe Colombo?
[Re: Vigil]
#695485
02/09/13 06:47 PM
02/09/13 06:47 PM
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Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,108
Giancarlo
Underboss
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Underboss
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,108
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Who would have the most to gain by Colombo going? Carmine Persico by far, mind you he was not on the street but had a very strong crew. Michael Franzese believed that Carmine Persico played a role in his father's(Sonny Franzese)bank robbing conviction. With Franzese gone who else would stand in the way of Persico grabbing the top spot? With his strong crew on the street Carmine could easily know how unhappy people were w/Colombo. So Snake hires a black man to do the job knowing that Gallo will catch the heat for it and not the Persico crew. Gambino is fine as long as Colombo goes away and the civil rights B/S dies with Colombo & the hired hand(Johnson). Well said. & I agree. If it was Persico don't you think he would of needed Gambino's ok beforehand? Just taking out a boss without the ok from Carlo or the other family bosses? I could see Gallo doing it without the ok but Persico? Pretty dangerous move if thats what happened. Anybody know how the relationship was between Gambino and Carmine Persico? That is if they even had one. Would he have been Gambino's choice to be the next Colombo boss?
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Re: Who Put The Hit On Joe Colombo?
[Re: Don Cardi]
#695701
02/10/13 07:01 PM
02/10/13 07:01 PM
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Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 282 Nuevo Mexico
Vigil
Capo
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Capo
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 282
Nuevo Mexico
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I believe Persico and Gambino were totally on the same page with this one. It had to be that way for it to work so well. Carlo was practically the Commission at that point. I don't have tangible evidence and I wasn't there by any stretch, but a lot of accounts tell the same thing.
*** il capo di tutti capi ***
"You'll never meet another guy like me if you live to be 5, 000." -John Gotti
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Re: Who Put The Hit On Joe Columbo?
[Re: Lenin_and_McCarthy]
#696519
02/14/13 07:21 AM
02/14/13 07:21 AM
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Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,108
Giancarlo
Underboss
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Underboss
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,108
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If anyone has an NYT archives subscription, there's also an article in the Joe Colombo references discussing this. I have it. It's a pdf file. "Suspect in Shooting of Colombo linked to Gambino Family" http://www52.zippyshare.com/v/3763562/file.htmlJust click the "Download Now" button on the right and you can download the pdf.
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Re: Who Put The Hit On Joe Columbo?
[Re: Don Cardi]
#699464
02/25/13 02:57 AM
02/25/13 02:57 AM
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Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 282 Nuevo Mexico
Vigil
Capo
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Capo
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 282
Nuevo Mexico
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Yeah, just like Booth, Oswald & Sirhansirhan. Naw, planned, organized, executed & wiped clean, with the real culprits untraceable.
*** il capo di tutti capi ***
"You'll never meet another guy like me if you live to be 5, 000." -John Gotti
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