So, if one or more of the elementary school staff would have been armed, more people would have died?

Ha ha ha Thanks PB! That really lightened the mood. Ya think there is still the Archie Bunker mentality today?

I forgot how funny he was but can NOT imagine that show on today. Oh, and look how young the "Meathead" was.



TIS

Thanks, Tis. That's what I was hoping to do .

I'm completely shocked and dumbfounded by the tragedy that has unfolded in Newtown, CT. I seriously hope that the man who did this was mentally unhinged and not in control of his mental faculties, because I can't wrap my brain around someone who is in their right mind committing such a heinous, horrifying crime. My heart goes out to the families and friends of the departed. 20 sets of parents are now gonna have to spend Christmas without their children. That devastates me.

I don't know how accurate these statistics are, but they can't be too far off the mark:

My high school had a mini-police precinct (literally) in the basement, along with metal and BOMB detectors when you enter the school, id's to swipe into a machine, security guards, individual searches, etc. A few kids use to try and sneak blades into their sandwiches in the morning. Just a normal everyday experience going to school in the BX, it became the norm for me.

But you know what? Nothing like this has ever happened in the Bronx. So maybe they're on to something here .

Very true, I actually got use to it. Took an extra 5-10 minutes (depending on the lines) to go into the school in the morning but not a big deal.

Well, I have almost thirty years on you, Dapper. It would have been unheard of in my day. But I think my parents would have understood if that was the case.

I know FiveFelonies (thanks) posted this earlier, but here it is in an article form. Contains interesting details about the whole buying a gun process which I am personally not too familiar with.

Expert: Conn. Gun Laws Need Background Checks, Limit On Guns Purchased At Once Following School Shooting

As the reasoning behind the horrific mass shooting at a Connecticut elementary school that left 27 dead, at least 18 of which are children, continues to be investigated, the tragedy will inevitably open up new discussion concerning stricter gun laws in Connecticut and nationwide.

The shooting at Sandy Hook Elementary School in Newtown, Conn., on Friday morning comes during a time when Connecticut is considered to have some of the stronger gun laws in the nation. According to “Gun Laws Matter 2012” from the Law Center to Prevent Gun Violence, Connecticut has the fourth strongest gun laws in the nation, which coincides with the state as having the sixth lowest gun death rate. The state also “exports crime guns at a rate that is less than half the national average,” according to “Gun Laws Matter 2012.”

But even with gun laws that are considered better than other states, the laws are by no means strict. Robyn Thomas, executive director of the Law Center to Prevent Gun Violence, told CBS Connecticut that background checks are not required on all transfers of firearms, giving easier access to those who would otherwise fail a background check.

When it comes to buying guns from licensed dealers in Connecticut, a gun license and eligibility certificate is needed. In Friday’s shooting, police confirmed that one of the guns used was a .22-caliber Long Rifle, a gun often used for sports shooting. According to the state, a state permit is not required to purchase a long gun in Connecticut such as the .22-caliber Long Rifle reportedly used in the tragedy. In regard to long guns in the state, there is a two-week period on transfers of long guns if the purchase is made through a licensed dealer. But if the purchase is made through a private dealer, there is no waiting period for access in Connecticut to the king of long gun used in the tragedy in Newtown.

“Some of the laws Connecticut does have includes a background-check law at gun shows, but there are no background checks required for private transfers of long guns,” Thomas said. “If I sold you my gun and you lived next door, you don’t have to have a background check. You’re not supposed to have assault weapons and .50-caliber rifles, but you can transfer and possess large caliber magazines through private dealers.”

Though the number of guns used Friday morning remains unclear at this point, a number of loopholes in the state’s gun laws could be examined. One of them is that the state does not limit the number of firearms that may be purchased at one time through both licensed and private dealers. The state also fails at regulating ammunition sales and imposing design safety standards on guns that make their way into the state, Thomas said. The unlimited number of firearms that can be purchased at once coupled with the lack of transparency on ammunition sales facilitates a loophole for which gun owners to build a potentially sizable arsenal through both licensed and private dealers.

“Connecticut does have good laws, but a lot more could be done,” Thomas said. “We continue to say that part of the issue is simply there are too many guns and they are too easy to get.”

Following one of the most horrific school shootings in the country’s history, the tragedy could indeed bring about change in Connecticut. Thomas said she wouldn’t be surprised if background checks would be enforced on the transfers of all firearms in the state. She added that the ban of large capacity ammunition magazines could also come about if the state is serious about tightening up gun laws in the wake of the school shooting.

“When you focus on issues that impact mass shootings, people get their heads around what’s at stake,” Thomas said.

http://connecticut.cbslocal.com/2012/12/...chool-shooting/

After four years of going through this daily (even the parents had to as well if they visited), most students already knew the cops/security guards by names, were on friendly terms, etc. Nice people, actually encourage the use of these measures (quite expensive im sure)

RIP to the victims and their families, this was a horrible tragedy.

i don't necessarily think all schools, particularly suburban or more rural schools need to go that far as it seems they are more in danger from outside sources rather than students themselves. with that said, that model seems to work very well in more crowded, and potentially more gang infested innercity schools. i am in favor of at least an armed security guard with at least a wand, so that way EVERYBODY who enters the school is subject to a quick check. it just seems to me that having to be "buzzed" in isn't sufficient enough, as once you are inside all bets are off. the guard also doesn't have to open carry his weapon, it could be concealed inside the waistband to help prevent unnecesaarly worry on the students part.

one of ammendment to the current laws that makes sense and i would support 100% like i have stated before is to make backround checks mandatory on all private gun sales. two people want to make a deal, so they can meet up at a gun shop or anywhere else where an fbi backround check can be legally preformed, pay a small fee, and have documentation protect the public as well as eliminate any liabilty on the part of the seller.

Well your first point can also be argued the other way, tragedies like Newtown, Columbine, etc in communities that are not inner-city would suggest that these are the communities that would need at a minimum a number of these measures implemented the most, but I agree that innercity schools are the ones that nowadays should require this type of security model to deter problems that are caused by gangs,etc.

My high school was a case in point, we had every kind of gang. Crips, bloods, Latin Kings, Asians, sons of wiseguys, which when all mixed up make for a very interesting school day to say the least.My HS had a fullpage spread in the NYTimes a few years back when Bloomberg finally closed/broke it up. I wont say the name for obvious reasons. How did I survive this without any problems people (particularly from rural/suburban areas)always ask me? Well, I was friends with everybody (naturally friendly) plus I was that kid on the baseball team, class president, honor roll, college bound, etc that everybody knew/liked. Helped me stay alive thats for sure, many of these violent kids look out/are very friendly to the popular kids (not always).

It's important to keep in mind the fiscal effects of preventive measures. In Texas, about one half of funding for public schools comes from local property taxes while most of the remaining funding comes from the State. Depending on the additional security, funding of it could require a prodigious increase in local property taxes which currently far outstrips municipal and county property taxes. Given that Texas has a balanced budget provision in its Constitution, any additional State funding of education would have to demonstrate a revenue source to pay for it. Since Texas does not impose a property or income tax, voters would have to condier amending the Constitution to impleemnt one or both. The only other alternative would be increasig the State sales tax.

I absolutely agree. In my HS the annual costs of these measures were over $500k a yr, which is a bunch of money for a school to sustain when already grappling with other issues like overcrowding, lack of books, etc.

And there's no truth to this is there?



TIS

Thats BS, lol

the nra gets alot of undeserved heat. i'm certainly not a fan of lobbyists in general, but there are more than a few anti-gun lobbies, so unless we want to get rid of all of them(not a bad idea ) it is what it is. they are pushing an agenda which they, and i, believe is worthwhile. if you don't agree with them, here's an easy solution, donate money to the brady campaign or wherever else you want. some of the accusations thrown at them are just downright disgusting. they are not some racist kkk organization, nor are they responsible for these mass shootings, thats just crap.

For those who claim that having armed guards or armed teachers could stop these shootings, please remember that Presidents have been shot while being protected by one of the best armed security forces in the world.

I read today that since the Columbine massacre in 1999, 266 people have died in spree shootings in the US. That does NOT include the shooters themselves, many who have taken their own lives. When you add in the shooters and the injured, the number approaches 500. And most of them involved shooters who had obtained their guns legally. Don't tell me our gun laws are not an issue.

As for on-screen violence and its contribution, my daughter actually just did her nursing psych rotation and wrote an in-depth research paper on the topic. Her hypothesis was that violence in TV, movies and video games contributes to violent behavior. However, her research actually proved her theory wrong. While exposure to violence did desensitize reactions to violence, it did not make the viewer more violent themselves.

FS, yes, the knife rampages in China are indeed horrible. However, I'm sure that Newtown would rather have 22 injured children (and none of them seriously injured) than be facing 28 funerals in the next week.

Well, as I posted above: if any of the staff at the school had been armed, would the death toll have been the same?

People blaming the media on this (why?) really want another scapegoat beyond the you know...

I know media is anxious to report, BUT they've mis-reported this story a lot. First they thought the shooter was the brother of the shooter.

They said the shooter entered the school with no problem. Now today say he shot window to get in.


NOW the media is saying there is NO connection between the school and the shooter's mother, when they had originally reported she taught there, and then that she maybe subbed there. There's a couple others, but I can't think of them right now. I like to be updated, but they should wait to confirm before they report something.

On another note they said there was an altercation a couple days ago between Lanza, the Principal and 2 Psychologists and another person. All were killed yesterday but one person who was not there yesterday.


TIS

Be the first with the story, it doesn't matter if it's right, apparently!

I'm wondering IF his mom isn't associated with the school, and if the altercation occurred, why kill 20 children?

Oh, another report I heard just today (tho I wouldn't swear by it after all the mis reports). They said Lanza had mental problems (ya think?) autistic-like (whatever that means). That may turn out to be totally false, but something tells me there were mental issues.



TIS

ive read/heard he had a mild form of autism called aspergers disease.

Thanks. I have only recently found out what aspergers is. Maybe it is true then.


TIS

I had a classmate in business school with it, she is extremely intelligent (particularly about American politics) and hardworking but had extremely poor social skills. These are the same characteristics i have been reading that this shooter possessed.

This is a very interesting read...

A Land Without Guns: How Japan Has Virtually Eliminated Shooting Deaths

In part by forbidding almost all forms of firearm ownership, Japan has as few as two gun-related homicides a year.

http://www.theatlantic.com/international...-deaths/260189/