Faithful1, To answer your question. Chicago was allied with the very powerful Genovese Family. That's who they dealt with in New York. If anybody from Chicago went to New York on occasion, that's who they would see. I never heard about them seeing the Gambinos or anyone else.

It was understood that the relationship was between Chicago and The Genovese's and to be honest, both sides valued it. the Genovese's had an edge over the other 4 families having Chicago as their ally. Chicago had the same advantage having a powerhouse like the Genovese's as their ally.
During The Giancana reign which lasted about 8 years, Sometimes Mooney went to New York with Joey Glimco. Glimco was a strong made guy who was involved with the Unions and was direct with Mooney.

In the later years, Cerone would sometimes go to New York with Willie Messino, his driver & Bodyguard. Willie was very proud to go. I remember him saying to a couple of the other guys that he liked it that the Genovese top men saw that he was Jack's man.

The Genovese Family had a smaller type of partnership in some way with Chicago in Las Vegas that I never really understood. None of the other Families, only the Genovese's.

So, as you can see, there was no big competition really between New York and Chicago because Chicago was in with the Genovese Family. The Genovese Family liked Chicago better than they liked the Bonanno's. Far better.

The only completion I see is from a couple of delusional posters on this forum. LOL

Chicago,

Sorry if you answered this already, but what are your thoughts on who killed Giancana?

And how about the Bay of Pigs/JFK/Monroe stuff?

What you say would make sense however the Kennedy witch hunt included a very broad variety of Organized Crime, although we all know today Giancana and Marcello were at the top of his list. By the way, Marcello, was one of the most influential bosses during this era. Anyways, while the Outfit had a legal war I can assure you the bottom line did not suffer. Yes the mob sold out of many casinos and made a fortune, but the outfit also hung on to few interests, the most famous being the Stardust. Aside from the casino business, the Outfit also controlled all typical organized crime in Las Vegas as well. It was also during this era Mr. Roseli brokered gun funneling programs in central America, while Mr. Giancana brokered gun funneling programs in the Middle East, ahhh the great proxy war era. I was also informed once by the Lebanese consulate, the Chicago Outfit had millions invested in Beirut, Lebanon....hidden in their banks as well as bankrolling major casinos similar to their holdings in Iran. I can seriously go on and on, and I am really just touching the surface of one area. We studied this organization, as there has been and most likely will be nothing ever more like it in this country. The Outfit was the epitome of a finely tuned streamlined business....but the catch was, the whole show was illegal. Fascinating to say the least.

jonnynonos, I don't know who pulled the trigger. I just know it was not my father. He saw Mooney earlier in the evening on that June night in 1975. He loved Mooney. Auippa/Cerone would never have trusted him to do the job. He would have warned Mooney.
I don't know who actually pulled the trigger but I can tell you that Dominic Blasi set it up because he went over there afterwards.

If I had to TAKE A GUESS, it was Dominic Blasi who also pulled the trigger. He was presently the driver bodyguard for Accardo and was direct with Auippa/Cerone. He fit nicely into the new regime. My father had to leave town for awhile. It was a terrible time.

Very true. What good is the body if the head is decapitated? Hard to enforce protocol or expand influence when the "home base" has been sacked. That's the problem every criminal organization has, especially in this country. The Mafia, or in Chicago's case the Outfit will never be what they were. There's a bigger power in the game now, the Federal Government. I can guarantee that our Government has become more detrimental to the average persons' daily life than the Mob ever could have been. Corruption in any society is inevitable, you guys might think I'm nuts.....but there were plenty of times when the Mob has been necessary.

The largest Mafia Group in the world has traditionally been non Italian and sitting somewhere within the Government.

Yawn.

Nice

he must have been away for too long

he shouldn't have let that mothafucka in his house if he's driving accardo around

Thanks for answering our questions Chicago. I know some of it's probably repetitive but you're a credit to boards as we micks would say.

Blasi was also Mooney's chauffeur and gopher before Sam went away. That's why Blasi is such a top suspect, he's probably one of the only people he would trusted enough to let in to the house and turn his back on.

Thanks Tony Pro, I just don't respond to Cook County anymore because he says stupid things on purpose for attention. In addition, he knows nothing about the Outfit or he would have known how close Giancana and Blasi were for many years. LOL.

What exactly were you expecting when u 'guarantee' the government is worse than the mob.
I mean seriously.

you mean how close they were before giancana went to mexico

in his absence blasi obviously got in good with accardo and company

giancana got caught slipping

Just about every publication lists three or four names associated with Sam Giancana's murder. I don't feel a need to list the names because everybody's heard them. There will probably never be a clear- cut answer.

One matter that is very troubling is the follow-up investigation, or the absence of an investigation. Since muder is not a federal offense, the responsibility to investigate fell to local authorities. NOT SO. Giancana's was testifying as a federal witness whether he liked it or not. Federal authorities had every legal right to look into this murder. There was what I would call a cursory investigation and not much more. Some leaders in congress called for a "complete and total" investigation. Never happened.

The follow-up investigation of Giancana took on the smell of a seven day old gutted sea bass. The same can be said for the murder of Johnny Roselli.

Cook County, Giancana joined the Vice Lords when he came back to Chicago. That's why he was slippin.'

naw that wasn't it

he wasn't thinking about being top boss the night before mexico extradited him

then he gets back and thinks he's gonna take over just because

arrogance was his downfall

AMEN !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

LOLOLOL !!!!!!!! Cmon Chicago I figured it would've been the Players, Park Boys or even the old Taylor Street Jousters...:)

What about Spilotro? I think Corbitt said in his book that Hy Larner may have ordered Spilotro to hit Giancana.

Lebanon, Iran, Israel, Panama, Costa Rica, Spain, Aruba all had Outfit influence at one point. Central America into the 1990s. Is any of it left other than Aruba?

Hy Larner could not have ordered Spilotro to go to the bathroom.
Where do you get such ideas? Corbitt would never say such a thing because it is ridiculous. You must have misread it.

Anyway, Aruba is about it to my knowledge.
Stop reading so many books. LOL.

First of all it's a little bit of an unequal comparison to compare the Chicago Outfit to the NY mob. Chicago is one organization whereas as N Y is made up of 5 families. However, with that said Chicago was still just as if not more powerful than NY. When Frank Sinatra's son was kidnaped and he paid the ransom and he thought the kidnappers double crossed him he was about to call Sam Giancana for help not anyone from the NY mob. It was the Chicago Outfit that pulled of the assistant ion of President Kennedy. There are many many more examples from history that show the far reaching power of the Chicago Outfit. Even though they are smaller and operate in a smaller city than the NY mob there power is about equal if not more than the 5 NY families

Policy King, When we're talking about Chicago and New York, we have to compare Chicago ONE ON ONE with each of the New York families. You are correct.

That being said, Chicago and the 5 Families were basically all on an equal basis ONE ON ONE years ago.
The Genovese Powerhouse Family was ALLIED with Chicago giving them an edge over the other 4.

Flash forward to 2013.
Genovese
Gambino
3 other N.Y.Families.

Now, down here would be the other 5 remaining Families in America. Chicago, New Jersey, Philly, New England & Detroit.

Note: Chicago would be in better shape if the first string team had not retreated years ago.

There you have it: Reality 40 years ago versus Reality today.

Granted you have the family history, but I too grew up in Chicago, albeit a little after the mob's heyday. I didn't say it was fact, just a theory that Corbitt wrote in his book. According to Corbitt, Hy Larner pretty much controlled Giancana, Las Vegas and the entire weapons/drug trade of the Outfit due to his massive political connections. I don't know if it's true or not because I wasn't around until after the Giancana hit, but why couldn't it be true?

I grew up two doors down from a guy that supposedly worked for Larner well into the 1990s. I never had much interaction as I was a kid in the 1980s, but later on heard the rumors.

Nobody ever controlled Giancana. EVER.

Did I hear that right ? Chicago power is equal to the 5 families ?

NYC is 3x the size of Chicago and GDP is probably even higher . That's not even factoring in Long Island or NJ which is the densest population in the country , and NJ mob influence is arguably the biggest in the country, or close

I think an argument can be made that Chi was on par with the Colombo's or Bonnano in certain times although it didnt quite have the man power strength of these families .

Chicago was one powerful group but they never had the man or earning power held by the Genovese , Gambino or Luchesse .

I get the whole home team thing but lets be a little realistic , lol , at least to make the discussion believable . Overall there is some good info in this thread , especially by Chicago who knows more about the Outfit then any other poster , reporter or author I know of.

As I posted before, through most of history I'd agree with DB. However from approx. 1955 to 1975 there was no criminal entity in this nation that could compare to the Chicago Outfits influence. They were streamlined and international. You could for one moment forget about Vegas, LA, KC, even Mil. The scope of the influence in central Mexico, Iran and Lebanon is staggering. As I posted before since 1990 the Outfit no longer compares to any of the families in New York as their influence has been greatly diminished, however in their glory day they were more diverse than GE

Thanks DB, Yeh, Policy King was overdoing it so I politely spelled it out more accurately. Anytime a lot of people start talking about something that is mysterious and powerful, the more they talk the bigger and bigger the exaggerations start to become with power, money etc. until it goes into non reality. Organized crime is one of the most exaggerated topics I have ever seen discussed in this Country.

Do you know that Big Bad Powerful Sam Giancana would come over to our house sometimes when I was a kid and complain about his daughter who was out of control.
Here's a guy who has been exaggerated by some people (like his brother Chuck) into the realm of non reality and yet sometimes he was just a simple guy who had trouble controlling his own daughter. That's the Sam Giancana I remember sometimes from childhood. LOL.