Accardo didn't groom him, he aligned himself with him because he had no other choice, he & Cerone weren't powerful enough by themselves & didn't Have the manpower to overtake the Thing on their own. I dunno why you insist on painting Tony accardo out to be this all-powerful generational Outfit overlord who orchestrated everything on his own.

Garymartin posted some articles that refute any such nonsense in the Chicago Outfit & Horsemeat Industry thread

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@huronsocial


aiuppa didn't just up and become boss on his own

it seems like chicago has always been run like a corporation

two of the top three guys after aiuppa took over were from the same crew

having 2 of the top 3 guys in the same crew is better than just having 1

Accardo wasn't issuing orders to Aiuppa thats for sure.

Sure he did. He amassed a ton of men & power in Cicero. Accardo & Cerone certainly didn't help him with that. When Giancana's crew began to fall apart, Aiuppa & his Cicero family were in a position to make moves to take over. Accardo & Cerone realized this & jumped on their side.

Aiuppa couldn't stand the northside people, it's pretty well documented that he wanted to have Jackie Cerone killed, and Cerone was Accardos protege.

@funkster no of course not they worked together in harmony until the Vegas fiasco. After that everyone began pointing fingers & playing the blame game. Lombardo & Cerone had big targets on their backs in the late 80s/early 90s. A lot of higher ups blamed Lombardo for Tony Spilotro's mishaps. And of course the idea that Louis Eboli, another capo that Lombardo was responsible for, may have been skimming from his rackets did not sit well with Cicero.

Unless I'm mistaken, the list of "made guys" was just someone's educated guess to correspond to the feds' "28" declaration. I don't think the feds ever released a list like that' just the number.

You are correct. It was from the Real Deal forum. The "28" referred to guys on the street and not dead, in jail, or retired. And that's just the guys that Calabrese knew about.

I didn't know that no. was from Calabrese, though I guess that makes sense since it was reported around the same time as the trial.

I do remember they said Nick had knowledge of 60 made guys, but that number clearly referred to dead and jailed too...as we have gone over here many times .

Calabrese didn't recognize everyone at the making ceremony or the Spilotro murders so it's not unfeasible to suggest that there were a few guys out there that he didn't know of.

More than a few guys. There are a few guys on there who aren't made (Joey DiFronzo) and a few that aren't even real gangsters (Rocco Lombardo).

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Actually, I started having second thoughts and double checked the source. It was actually an FBI agent during the Family Secrets trial who cited that number, although the fact remains that it was tabulating active Outfit members active and on the street.

Yeah, that's what I thought.

And no, of course Nick probably wouldn't have known anyone.

But the feds did not, as we just determined, come up with the number based solely on Nick's testimony. Or, maybe they did. But in any event they didn't say how they came up with it, so we don't know.

I remember around that time it also came out that they had at least one other high level informant, too. (Not Nick.)

It's likely they actually have a pretty thorough understanding of a lot about the organization. But they only move when they can prove something. And we generally only find out what they know at a trial. Too bad !

I'd say without a doubt. There were multiple times he mentioned having met some of those guys for the very first time when he was discussing having met guys like Marcello in the 80s.

Hey, johnnynonos, Huron, and funkster: Check your PM's, please.

Didn't get anything man.

Sorry, I added an "h" in your name, that's why you didn't get it. Should be good now.

Sorry about my last post. I accidentally hit the wrong button and posted it in the wrong thread. I took it down.

Listed below is a link to a newspaper which mentions the 28 made men. Also has a picture of Mitch Mars and discussion about FS. Hope it opens.

Robert Grant - FBI - 2007 & again 2011 or 2012 - 28 made men and 100 associates.

http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/nation/2007-09-27-3043193147_x.htm

http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=2245&dat=20070928&id=Av1RAAAAIBAJ&sjid=hjQNAAAAIBAJ&pg=5877,3405826

Not sure why, but I randomly checked and it looks like Lou Marino is getting out in November. For some reason I could have swore he wasn't scheduled to be released until 2015 or 16...was thinking around the same time as Gabeet.

You sure you weren't getting him mixed up with Bellavia?

Nah, if you check his wiki it still has him listed as being released in feb 2015. Wonder if its one of those administrative things where he's gonna get out a few months earlier than expected. Though I do see that Snakes had him listed already as getting out in nov.

Yeah, I seem to remember it being 2015 but maybe they chopped a couple of months off for "good behavior" and they don't institute it until it's been approved or something.

Either way, Marino might get a piece of something when he gets out but the guy's 82 and he'll have a parole officer on his ass 24/7, so I doubt he'll really need to do anything the rest of his life beyond sitting on his duff.

Thing is, Louie Marino is one of the more legendary enforcers in Outfit history. He was the Infelise crew's #1 heavy. The guy bleeds Chicago Outfit. His welcomed his kid into the Life. It's just difficult to imagine him getting out & not going right back into it. He's going to receive overwhelming amounts of respect & honor for being who he is & standing on his head for so long.

The guy is the definition of a legend/relic.

I know he's a stone gangster but 82 is pretty damn old for anybody to get out and do much as far as street stuff is concerned.

It all comes down to personality. Who knows when a guy is going to retire? Sonny Franzese came out of the can and continued in the rackets until his latest conviction while he was in his 90s. Could go either way, I could easily see Marino start up again and my guess is he'd have a fairly high status given his toughness and the fact that he just did a 20 something odd year stint.

In the end, my guess is if he retires its because he doesn't want to risk going back to the can...not because he doesn't want to deal with the rackets anymore at his age.

Fairly high is an understatement. He will get whatever the hell he wants on a golden platter and then some.

The next year and a half is going to be a fun one for Outfit watchers, especially in Cicero with Marino, Gabeet, and Spano all getting out roughly at the same times.

I agree funk, I think within the next 2 years we'll see a couple of the boys headed to the can. Shit whatever happened with the the case with the guy from Cicero, Paul C. I'd be done if I was Solly, this fucking guy knows their on his ass and just doesn't seem to give a shit, lol. I was thinking Louie Tomatoes would enjoy the twilight years of his life but these guys go till they can't go no more.