The link says that they expanded into other states and grew into a multi-million dollar operation with links to the cartels by the 90's. They didn't create the label until 2000.

I don't know why you guys are still bothering with this guy. Regardless of the links to the articles and all the other proofs produced, the guy just refuses to believe that BMF was a drug enterprise before they became a record label. And you're right Dave, BMF the label didn't amount to shit, the only reason they have cred now, as a label, is because of Young Jeezy. Another BMF street affiliate whom they signed to a record deal. Jeezy was the only one who actually made it into something.

Cause I don't know shit about the Black Souls. Why comment on something I'm not familiar with...I'm familiar with most of the gangs I've named though. The term mob for most of them, sure it can be used to describe them. But a more accurate term would be a street gang, which is what I've always been saying, VL's aren't this organized, global or even local force dealing in white collar crimes and other illegal activities, the way you're claiming they are. With most of those gangs, there is little organization, they have no real leadership, and that isn't the minority, it's the majority of them. Majority of the Chicago organizations are fractured and not what they were in the 80's.


And this isn't a new thing, guys have been sent to prison, the older heads, the guys with the clout to call themselves leaders have been indicted, convicted, and killed. Thus turning these large gangs, into small cliques with little to no allegiance to each other. And they're killing each other, it's been happening for years and recently people are now seeing the brunt of the damage this causes. This is Chicago's current problem, it's why the murder rates are so high, "Chiraq". It's all because the gangs are warring and killing each other.

There are still numerous young people who claim BGD. Or BD, however you want to put it, it isn't just "GD's", and that's another example of one of your organizations or mobs, being more accurately described as street gangs. That's one part of the grudge right there, GDs claiming there are no BD's or BGDs and the two sides warring with each other, and it isn't stopping once they go to jail. Chief Keef just recently sparked a surge of young people claiming BGD. And Chief Keef wasn't out there repping by himself, he's from a neighborhood full of young people calling themselves BD's warring with GD's and other decks of this so called "Nation". And outside of Chicago, they aren't even worth being mentioned. You really think GD's in NY pull any strings here? Nope. And when it comes to illegal profits and activities, they're at the bottom of the totem pole. GD's here don't know if they want to be GD's or Crips. Everywhere outside of Chicago, from my experiences, like VA, Maryland and Jersey, this seems to be the case, a case of mistaken identity.

70 different groups? With the top 11 having thousands of members? You're definitely overdoing the current ability of these street gangs you're mentioning. Again in the case of "GDN" outside of Chicago they're all doing their own thing, they take no type of order from Chicago, in most cases they don't even interact with "GDN" back in Chicago, especially in the case of NY GD's. Considering all of that, those numbers come down when you realize the ones in Chicago are killing off one another, and the supposed "GD's" in other places, have no interaction with Chicago, in reality there is no "nationwide chapters with the same corporate structure", when they don't even interact with one another. There's no Chicago GD's coming to NY to set up meetings and layout crimes, and vice versa. It's every man for themselves.


These organzations you're mentioning simply aren't as strong as organized and viable as you're claiming them to be.

I want to first apologize to Scorsese for getting off topic and hope you don't mind. My goodness your misinformed to a certain degree. AS I is said you should check all my post history on Chicago gangs as I've been through this discussion once before. If all the Chi gangs are so fractured which it actually vary from mob to mob. So let me break it down once more, then afterword check my post history then do some research on other forums and see does it match.

-VLs hierarchy is proven so many times in court documents that it should be clear as day they structured. Not only in Chicago but also in surrounding mid-west cities and down south cities such as Memphis. As stated by Chicago PD & FBI their involved in typical gang crimes along with white collar fraud and other low risk crimes.

- Your right it's no longer the 80s nor 90s but their still is leadership. As i stated before the most recent case will be : Latin King Inca indicted in 011/012, Dub I VL chief being indicted who lived in Las Vegas with his family while managing his branch in Chicago through elites in 013, Black Soul's New Life branch chief and princes being indicted on racketeering charges back in 012. These were already posted on here. Their still organized, fact.

-True yet it's mostly the GDs, BDs, Stones renegade cliques causing on the drama and it's different scenarios from block to block. Not everybody is warring like back from 70s-90s. Chicago murders have decrease modesty from the mid to late 90s. Unfortunately that's how the young generation sees it but it really was "Chiraq" before they was born. Just typical misguided youth sadly.

- Let me explain in detail, BGD formed in 1969 as an umbrella alliance to opposed the BPSN. At that time , Larry Hoover led the Supreme Gangsters and David Barksdale led Devils Disciple. By 1974, Hoover were locked up (1973) in state pen for the murder of a drug dealer and Barksdale died from kidney complications due to gunshot wounds. Barksdale's successor Shorty decided to reform the BDN as a mob not umbrella and broke away from the BGD and afterwards Hoover changed the BGD into a mob. As time went on Hoover change the internal hierachy to a corporate concept and along the way dropped the "B" from the mob name in/around 83. Therefore it's GD. GDs & BDs started to war with each other on the south side and north side in the late 80s/ early 90s over turf and one successful move a GD deck flipped to BDs. Since then different south side blocks have on/off GD//BD conflicts. Ex: Lamron (BDs) war against Tookaville (GDs) in Englewood yet Dro City in East side are GDs & BDs partner up. Therefore BGD on the streets of chicago doesn't exist with the young cats just GDs, BDs, and these renegades cliques calling themselves Insane Gs. Chief Keef is/was BD.

-I agree with you on the GDs in NYC but they are EBK (everybody killer, rival to Crips & UBN).Matter of fact the NYC GDs had a project to themselves were well known for their activities.That's the past and now, I have not a clue .But that's the thing about NYC gangland (minus the hoodlum/drug crews), it's eccentric and full of UBN & crips sets for the majority and chi black gangs are minor. You may of just run into some confused crips claiming the 6 star and other GD logos, :/, or fakes. GDs that rotate know their proper demonstration.

-Those numbers come from the Chicago PD gang unit or their investigators. Sounds right anyway because of how spread out they are but again we're dealing with estimates. As for the GDs structure as i mentioned and said their proof that SOME of the other GD locations uses the same hierarchy which was detailed in Operation Headache. There's proof once again from Minneapolis, Memphis, Houston, and other cities that GDs utilized that hierarchy in a similar fashion. Chicago is called the motherland but it doesn't function like a central commanding system and they are aware of the GD vs Insane G situation and yes some do "rotate" with the motherland. In prison everybody falls in line period in which it's truly an organization. It's like that here in Parchman. That renegade/insanes clique BS don't fly, any GD from the Chi will tell you that.

Like I said, before you instantly reply back go over my post in read all those articles and case documents. And if that doesn't convince you enough then go to KollegeKidd.com and read through some comments. It's a lot of back n forth banter of course but you'll see consistent pattern of correct info. There's much going inside they world that we don't know looking from the outside.

Also, Black Souls still the most tight knit and heavily involved in high levels of drugs & guns trafficking also white collar crimes and the Chicago police chief stated this info and that they were difficult to infiltrate. Mob fits them.

The First Lady of BMF: Tonesa Welch shares her story of the rise and fall of the Black Mafia Family https://gangstersinc.org/2025/02/18...rise-and-fall-of-the-black-mafia-family/