I swear if anyone hints at some sort of Buffalo involvement, I'm going to flip.

^^^^
Nicaso gives the opinion that the Musitano brothers hitched their wagon to the Rizzuto organization before 1997--here's the quote from the article:

I think the life of Angelo changed completely in 1997 when he decided to join the plot that ended with the murder of two major bosses in Ontario and he joined the Rizzuto crime family.

Does anyone think Nicaso is suggesting that the Musitano brothers had "formal" ties to or membership in the Montreal Mafia?

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/hamilton/musitano-death-1.4097416

Dubro says the two were never involved in very "sophisticated crimes," and that they were "more feared than respected."

Pat was the more fearsome of the two, Debro says.

"He will, in time, be killed," he said. "There's no question about that."



I am surprised at how blunt & confident James Dubro is about Pat will get killed in time.

He was also very blunt about Rizzuto being killed soon after returning to Canada.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/hamilton/musitano-death-1.4097416

Dubro says the two were never involved in very "sophisticated crimes," and that they were "more feared than respected."

Pat was the more fearsome of the two, Debro says.

"He will, in time, be killed," he said. "There's no question about that."



I am surprised at how blunt & confident James Dubro is about Pat will get killed in time.

With all due respect to James Dubro, I'm not so sure he really knows what's going on these days. When's the last time he wrote anything relevant to what's going on today? I loved Mob Rule and his Rocco perri book was pretty good too, but I haven't seen anything to indicate he has any idea about today. I recall him saying some things that were really questionable. I'm pretty sure he said at some point that the mob in Ontario was pretty much done, which is very far from the truth. I think they'd be better off speaking to adrian humphreys or Peter edwards regarding OC in ontario

Unfortunately, he was merely repeating what Lee Lamothe was quoted as saying the day after Nick Rizzuto Sr. died: "[Vito Rizzuto] doesn't have any options. He's a dead man walking. He's a very smart man, he may pull something out of the hat, but there is no power left to gather around him." ("A symmetry of violence in the Montreal mob." By Les Perreaux. Montreal — The Globe and Mail. Published Thursday, Nov. 11, 2010 9:51PM EST.)

And as you and many others know, on more than one organized-crime forum I foolishly parroted what Lamothe and Dubro were saying.

It does seem to me the Musitanos were a second-tier gang.

I agree that the Musitanos have often been considered second-tier in Hamilton's mob hierarchy but the scope of their activity can spread beyond the Hamilton area. For example, they were involved in a scheme to influence the big labour union LIUNA. I believe they were also part of a large sport book enterprise (connected to Rizzutos) that was eventually busted by the police a few years ago. After Giacomo Luppino died, the media and OC pundits always considered Johnny Papalia "the don" of Ontario and his crew dominated activity throughout the province. After Johnny was hit, those same pundits acclaimed the Musitano's as the new top family. However someone I know, who would be considered a mob 'associate', told me a couple of years ago that the Luppinos were always really the top family around here. Their scope was international and they pulled major deals. But their power began to fade too as the Luppino brothers aged. However, the next of generation of Luppino/Violi's are in their prime. They seem to have reasserted the family's position and influence. When the power struggle in Montreal was fully raging and trips were being made to Hamilton, it wasn't to visit Frank Papalia or Pat Musitano.

I think some Papalia family members are still involved with the remnants of the Buffalo family. The Papalia 'Ndrina is pretty big, but there was never trouble between them and the Musitanos in Italy.

9 times out of 10, Buffalo has shit all to do with any of this.

I agree that the Musitanos have often been considered second-tier in Hamilton's mob hierarchy but the scope of their activity can spread beyond the Hamilton area. For example, they were involved in a scheme to influence the big labour union LIUNA. I believe they were also part of a large sport book enterprise (connected to Rizzutos) that was eventually busted by the police a few years ago. After Giacomo Luppino died, the media and OC pundits always considered Johnny Papalia "the don" of Ontario and his crew dominated activity throughout the province. After Johnny was hit, those same pundits acclaimed the Musitano's as the new top family. However someone I know, who would be considered a mob 'associate', told me a couple of years ago that the Luppinos were always really the top family around here. Their scope was international and they pulled major deals. But their power began to fade too as the Luppino brothers aged. However, the next of generation of Luppino/Violi's are in their prime. They seem to have reasserted the family's position and influence. When the power struggle in Montreal was fully raging and trips were being made to Hamilton, it wasn't to visit Frank Papalia or Pat Musitano.

"Mobster wanted to bulletproof cars before brother’s murder. After the hit, he’s giving up his flashy Ferrari"

http://news.nationalpost.com/news/canada...-flashy-ferrari