Oops... guess that did not work out for him.

You should frame that.

That;s an idea..but i'd have to go through a shitload of yrs. of issues , it would take a while, my oldest issue is a 1971 featuring a very young Margot Kidder.

When Frank Fitzsimmons decentralized the Teamsters, enabling the mobsters to control their locals without any oversight from the nationals, Hoffa became absolutely useless. His only move was to just stay out of dodge. He was delusional. He thought he was a mob boss himself, and he made threats. It probably wasn't so much the threats that got him killed, but how much he knew. He was once tight with Tony Provenzano and the Giacalones of Detroit. That's Westside and pretty much all of the midwest families, considering Detroit's influence. He was untouchable. In his final days he only had Carmine Galante's ear, and even Carmine sold him out.

I don't think Hoffa was altogether a bad person. Idealists in the labor movement love to bash him but he had no choice but to cut the mob into the Teamsters. The auto manufacturers were sending goon squads by the hundreds to break up strikes. People were being beaten to death. In the 1930s, if you didn't have some bad guy muscle on your side, you may as well have stayed in your home. A lot of Hoffa's modern day critics just don't understand what the country was like then.

Hoffa's rise to power coincided with the mob's. The bigger he got, the bigger the mob got, and vice versa. You can't blame him for believing he was part of the machine. But he was an outsider. Like Joe Pesci says in Casino. He wasn't one of them. He wasn't Italian. Just like the other Irish and Jewish associates, you have to know your time to walk away. The writing was on the wall for him and he overstayed his welcome, just like Siegel.

This is all true in perspective, but what does it have 2 do w/ the interview statement? He was told 3 times by Frank Sheeran via Russell Bufulino & Angie Bruno that he was not 2 run anymore.... & specifically told.." u know what this means" whereas Hoffa said "They wouldn't dare"....Hoffa was a strong minded individual & did not back down when it came to his positioning in power.

Now Dead.....&....Forgotten..

I was pretty much responding to your point about the interview, I just started rambling.

Hows about posting the Playboy in ,pdf, wiseguy?

what is pdf & I don't know how 2 transfer anything on this computer ...I don't own a cellphone, nor nobody will give me instruction...I asked my wife , but she seems a littlte stupid to it as I am...I am what is known as tech illiterate..u have no idea how many times I wish I could post a rare pic or a story like u guys,,by the way... I'm not trying 2 start shit w/u or be a wiseguy ...I always liked most of ur articulate posts...u seem to me an intelligent guy...but some things I would rather stray from.....( calling the Bible a work of fiction )...if somebody on here would instruct me how 2 post something other than my own words,,I'm game 4 a lesson....I even now forget how 2 start a thread of my own..I am a very intelligent guy in my own right, but when it comes 2 tech... I am dumbstruck... sorry...P.S. U can look up the Jimmy Hoffa Playboy Interview online if u try hard enough..No hard feelings Oak.

I was kidding.

I might already have it. My father took all of my grandfather's old playboys when he passed away. They're sitting in boxes somewhere in his garage with a bunch of Sports Illustrated magazines from the 80s. I've been meaning to go through them. The Hoffa one is a collector's item. That is pretty crazy that he disappeared right after that. I like Jimmy Hoffa. I've worked with my union on organizing and things like that, and most union people today despise Hoffa and feel compelled to prove how anti-Hoffa they are. The middle class wouldn't exist if it weren't for people like Hoffa. People don't realize what this country was like before most of our federal labor laws were passed. It was brutal, and union organizers like Hoffa had to make some tough decisions (and make some tough friends) to overcome them. His relationship to the mob was a necessary evil. His sin was not walking away as soon as he could. The power went to his head.

We can have our religious debate on another thread.

U couldn't have said it any better ...Hoffa was a good man & a man 4 the ppls.Sometimes on utube,,I observe his son on different occasions & feel bad 4 the guy...Dad didn't know the word NO.............anyways...PEACE !..b-tween us @ least....

Is Gangbusters by Ernest Volkman worth a read? I bought it but stopped reading after 20 or so pages cos it seemed more like a novel than a true crime book. Does it deserve another chance?

Haven't read it but based on the preview I read and it's reputation it is littered with made up BS. Which is a shame because it is about the Luchese family which I'd be really interested in.

Ernest Volkman has a bad rep, as an exageratter & as an a drunken author..his televised interviews r hilarious though.

Hitman: The Untold Story of Johnny Martorano: Whitey Bulger's Enforcer and the Most Feared Gangster in the Underworld by Howie Carr. This was a well researched and written account of Martorano's life. He was more of a business partner of Bulger's who killed heaps of people than a hitman or enforcer. Keeps you on the edge of your seat describing all the mayhem of the Boston underworld in the 60s and 70s.

SC

Here is my list organized crime books that I collected over the years.

American Mafia (history of it's rise to power Thomas Reppetto
A man of honor Joseph Bonanno
A Master of Deception Robert Knuckle
Accardo the genuine godfather William F Roemer jr.
Angel of Death William Marsden & Julian Sher
Boardwalk Empire Nelson Johnson/Terence Winter
Black Mass Dick Lehr/Gerard O'Neil
Blood & Honor (inside the scarfo mob) George Anastasia
Blood brothers Peter Edwards
Blood Washes Blood (about Sicily) Frank Viviano
Bloodletters and bad men Jay Robert Nash
Bloodlines Lee Lamothe & Antonio Nicaso
Blood and power Stephen Fox
Boss of Bosses Joseph F O'Brien & Andris Kurins
Bound by Honor Bill Bonanno
Business or Blood Peter Edwards & Antonio Nicaso
Capone Laurence Bergreen
Canadese Kenneth Bagnell
Claude Dubois Claude Dubois
Contract Killer William Hoffman & Lake Headley
Contract on America David Scheim
Cosa Nostra (an illustration history of the mafia) Massimo Picozzi
Cosa Nostra (History of the Sicilian Mafia) John Dickie
Crime Inc Martin Short
Crimes & Punishment Illustrated crime encyclopedia
Deadly Alliance Ralph Ranalli
Deadly Silence Peter Edwards & Antonio Nicasso
Donnie Brasco Joseph D Pistone
Double Cross Sam & Chuck Giancana
Double Deal Michael Corbitt & Sam Giancana
Duty (the life of a cop) *there a chapter on the fighting the mob Julian Fantino/Jerry Americ
Excellent Cadavers Alexander Stile
Fallen Angel Jerry Langton
Five Families Selwyn Raab
For the sins of my father Albert DeMeo
Frank Costello George Wolf & Joseph Di Mona
G-Men and Gangsters Dominic Spinale
Gangbusters Ernest Volkman
Gangland (The rise of Mexican drug Cartels) Jerry Langton
Gangland- (Gotti) Howard Blum
Gangland International James Norton
Gangster -Portraits in crime Joshua B Feder
Gangsters and Goodfellas Gus Russo/Henry Hill
Gangsters and organized crime in Buffalo Michael F Rizzo
Gangsters of Miami Ron Chepesiuk
Get Capone Jonathan Eig
Global Mafia Antonio Nicaso & Lee Lamothe
Gomorrah Roberto Saviano
Goombata John Cummings & Ernest Volkman
Gotti Rise and fall Jerry Capeci & Gene Mustain
Hard Road (satin's choice) Peter Edwards
Hells Angel Keith & Kent Zimmerman
Hells Angels into the Abyss Yves Lavigne
Hells Angels at War Yves Lavigne
Hells Angels-taking care of business Yves Lavigne
Hitman Howie Carr
Hoffa's Man Joe Franco & Richard Hammer
Honor thy Father Gay Talese
Iced Stephen Schneider
Infamous Manhatten Andrew Roth
Joe Dogs Joseph Iannuzzi
King of the Mob James Dubro & Robin F. Rowland
La Malapianta Nicola Gratteri/Antonio Nicaso signed copy
Last Days of the Sicilians Ralph Blumenthal
Little Man Meyer Lansky & the gangster life Robert Lacey
Mafia (the history of the mob) Nigel Cawthorne
Mafia (inside the dark heart) A.G.D Maran
Mafia Assassin - Ontario Mafia Cecil Kirby & Thomas C Renner
Mafia- complete history of a criminal world Jo Durden Smith
Mafia Dynasty John H Davis
Mafia Enforcer Thomad Renner & Cecil Kirby
Mafia for Beginners Arnd Schneider & Oscar Zarate
Mafia Inc. Andre Cedilot & Andre Noel
Mafia Kingfish- Carlos Marcello John H Davis
Mafia Princess Antoinette Ciancana & Thomas C Renner
Mafia USA Nicolas Gage
Mafia Wipeout Donald Cox
Mafia Wiseguys Robert Rudolph
Man against the Mob William F Roemer jr.
McMafia Misha Glenny
Men of Honor Giovanni Falcone & Marcelle Padovani
Mob Daughter Karen Gravano
Mob Girl Teresa Carpenter
Mob Mistress - Ontario James Dubro
Mob Rule James Dubro
Mob Star - ( J.Gotti) Gene Mustain & Jerry Capeci
Mobsters gangsters & men of honour Pierre de Champlain
Montreal's Irish Mafia D'arcy O'Connor & Miranda O'Connor
Money on the run Mario Passamai
Mr. Capone (the real & complete story of Capone) Robert J. Schoenberg
Murder Machine Gene Mustain & Jerry Capeci
MurderInc (Story of organized crime) Martin Short
No Angel Jay Dobyns & Nils Johnson Shelton
Omerta Mario Puzo
Organized crime (an inside guide Worlds most successful industry) Paul Lunde
Organized crime Michael Lyman & Gary Potter
Playboys illustrated history of Organized Crime Richard Hammer
Quitting the Mob Michael Franzese & Dary Matera
Rebel and Mafiosi James Fentress
Sinatra Club Sal Polisi & Steve Dougherty
Sixth Family version 2006 (38 chapters) Lee Lamothe & Adrian Humphreys
Sixth Family version 2008 (42 chapters) Lee Lamothe & Adrian Humphreys
The Bandido Massacre Peter Edwards
The Brotherhoods Guy Lawson & William Oldham
The Butcher Philip Carlo
The Canadian Connection Jean Pierre Charboneau
The ceremony Joseph Pistone
The Grim reapers Ed Reid
The Enforcer -(Joe Papalia) Adrian Humphreys
The Enforcer- Spilotro William F Roemer jr.
The Everything Mafia book James Mannion
The First Family Mike Dash
The French Connection Robin Moore
The Gangland War John Silvester & Andrew Rule
The Gangsters Timothy Jacobs
The Godfather Mario Puzo
The Good guys Jules Bonavolonta & Brian Duffy
The Goodfella tapes George Anastasia
The Gotti Tapes Ralph Blumenthal & John Miller
The Hoffa Wars Dan E Moldea
The Iceman Philip Carlo
The Infiltrator Robert Mazur (Medellin cartel)
The Insider Donald Goddard
The Last Days of the Sicilians Ralph Blumenthal
The Last Mafioso Ovid Demaris
The last testament of Lucky Luciano Martin Gosch & Richard Hammer
The Laundrymen Jeffery Robinson
The Mafia and the Machine Frank R Hayde
The Mafia (The mammoth book of the mafia) Nigel & Colin Cawthorne
The Mafia's greatest hits David H. Jacobs
The Mafia in Havana Enrique Cirules
The mafia is not an equal opportunity employer nicolas Gage
The Mafia of a Sicilian Village (1860-1960) Anton Blok
The Mistress of the mafia -Virginia Hill Ed Reid
The Mob and the city C.Alexander Hortis
The Nephew Real Simard & Michel Vastel
The Pizza Connection Shana Alexander
The Plumber (Philadelphia mob) Joseph Salerno & Stephen J Rivele
The Road to Hell Julian Sher and William Marsden
The story of the american Mob Sidney Zion
The Teamsters Steven Brill
The Valachi Papers Peter Maas
The war against the mafia Tim Shawcross
The Weasel Adrian Humphreys
Tough Jews Rich Cohen
Underboss- ( Sammy Gravano) Peter Maas
Under and Alone William Queen
Unfinished Business Donnie Brasco
Unrepentant Peter Edwards
War of the Godfathers William F Roemer jr.
Wise Guy (Henry Hill) Nicholas Pileggi
When the Mob ran Vegas Steve Fischer
World Famous Gangsters Ian Schott

Read a few of your collection...6th Family for me was top of the heap

Yes, that was one of my favorites too.

Good grief, Ciment. How about a short list of the mob books you haven't read?

There is probably around 15 books that I haven't read yet.

What did you think of Mob Rule?

I liked that one too. It identified the main characters of the Ontario Ndrangheta when few people were talking about it back then.

Also liked ICED

you are absolutely right...... in the book "you paint houses don't you" it tells of buffalino's attempt's to get hoffa to retire, hoffa just would not listen, he was warned many times.

I'm looking forward to reading the Frank Sheeran book. I want to see the Scorsese movie first.

Covert: My Years Infiltrating the Mob by Bob Delaney and Dave Scheiber. About a NJ State Trooper who went undercover investigating the mob. Great stuff. Definitely recommend it. Deals mainly with the mob messing with legitimate business in the 70s and features Tino Fiumara, John DiGilio, Jackie DiNorsico and others.

Just finished Little Al D'Arco's book finally, it was an amusing time passer , but now I'm a 1/4 way through Deal with the Devil about Greg Scarpa's association w/Lin Devecchio..starts off slow & seems like the author has got it in 4 the former FBI handler/agent & for good reason...he also writes like he's narrating a documentary , asking the reader questions ("did Scarpa cover his own tracks by informing on his own pal?..we will discuss more on that in chapter 9")...so far ,so good though.

Read both and liked them.

Deal with the Devil gets a bit winded when he gets into a lot of the court papers and trial information but picks back up when Greg starts his rampage.
Enjoy.

I've read about the first half of D'Arco's book about 3 maybe 4 times. Just never seemed to stay interested in it throughout to finish it. I loved the parts about how things were in the 40's and 50's in Little Italy and some of the stories he told about the time, place and people of that era.

Thats a nice collection! I have a few of those.. what would your top 10 be? I'm looking for a few new books.

Undercover Cop by Mike Russell. Really entertaining and interesting read, but it is hard to tell what is the truth or not after researching it more online.

I hate answering this question because there are many that I liked. It also depends what you are looking for. Some prefer biography books on mobsters others like to know more about the structure and life of a mobster. My interests have changed many times over the years. I started my interest with the American LCN, then shifted to the Italian Casa Nostra , Camorra, Ndrangheta and so on.

The ones I listed is what peaked my interest the most at one point. The Valachi papers was the first book I read on the mafia which makes me biased for that one.


Men of Honor by Judge Falcone
The Five Families
Valachi Papers
Excellent Cadavers
G-Men and Gangsters
Mafia Kingfish
Mr.Capone
Rebel and Mafiosi
Arcado genuine Godfather
Gomorrah
Mexican Drug Cartels